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this program is brought to you by the

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genesis communications network a world

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leader in talk radio since 1998 visit

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you're in the para cast the gold

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standard of paranormal radio now here's

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gene Stein so Chris O'Brien is on

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special assignment and therefore will

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not join us on this special episode of

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the para cast but last week one of the

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guests

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Erica Luke's has volunteered actually

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she did this kicking and screaming I

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think volunteered to be co-host this

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week right Erica I did because I always

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loved being on the para cast and I was

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especially excited when I heard who the

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guest was going to be talking to Lesley

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Kane in just a moment but first of all I

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wanted to kind of recap a few things and

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last week of course we had three women

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talking about different things and a

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couple of weird things came out of it

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like one person saying she never

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encountered a problem as a woman in the

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UFO field and then we had Erica back on

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after the para cast which is the special

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program we offer for subscribers to the

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power cast plus and she pointed out that

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maybe that isn't quite so realistic so

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is that summarize it pretty much that

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does summarize it pretty much should I

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think you know again it it highlighted

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an apathy that we have in the field to

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address issues and not only about

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women's issues but about the way we

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treat other people in the field and the

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fact that we don't have professional or

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ethical standards and that's something

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that needs to be addressed and I think

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that it was an important conversation

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that you and Chris had with us on the

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show so thank you Lesley a quick

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question before we get into the main

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subject here as a woman being involved

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in paranormal research first UFOs now

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life after death and such have you

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encountered issues that use might relay

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the fact that you're a woman I would

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have to say no gene but you know I

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haven't hung around with the UFO

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community crowd the probably the way a

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lot of other people have because it you

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know be

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journalist I sort of took played the

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journalist role so maybe that's partly

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why but I don't have any memories of

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feeling any of that that's great and I

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think it's an important point for you to

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say to that

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since you were in that role as

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journalists and you weren't necessarily

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going to conferences or involved in you

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know some of the organization's the

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volunteer organizations you were perhaps

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subject to that sort of thing

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yeah I think that's true I mean I did go

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to conferences in the first few years

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when I was just learning a lot about

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UFOs and I remember people were so happy

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that a journalist was taking the topic

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seriously it was just such a big deal

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because I published in The Boston Globe

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which was a mainstream newspaper and

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other mainstream media so everyone was

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so happy to have a journalist in their

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myths that they weren't gonna be sending

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any vibes my way because I was a female

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I just so it was just a different

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position that I was in than a lot of

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other women who are in the field and and

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you know dealing with it in a different

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way right that's great and I will say

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that you've maintained such integrity

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and professionalism Ben you've always

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been somebody that I have really held in

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a lot of high regard well thank you very

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much for that Erika I appreciate it yes

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thank you so up till now we've talked to

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you about UFOs but now you've written

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this book called surviving death a

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journalist investigates evidence for an

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afterlife

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what brought you on board with this

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subject well Jean you know I've been

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interested in this topic

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probably for as long as I have been

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interested in UFOs it's just that I

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didn't focus on it as my main topic

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obviously but it was sort of percolating

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in the background for me for many years

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and I've sort of poked around in it been

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intrigued by it I was involved with the

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making of a documentary film at one

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point on this topic which of having to

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meet a lot of the key players in it it's

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just been sort of an interest of mine

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really but not like UFOs were I mean I

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never did anything with it until I

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finished my book and then a year later I

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worked with on this History Channel

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documentary after that there was sort of

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a pause and it it just sort of naturally

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became the next

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topic for me to write a book on them

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because I was thinking about what to do

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next and my publisher actually

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approached me the same people who

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published my UFO book and said is there

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anything else you want to write about it

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just coincided with the exact timing of

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when I was thinking about approaching

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them with this topic so they were

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absolutely thrilled with the idea of a

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you know allowing having a journalist

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take on this information which is really

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very difficult to do much more difficult

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than UFOs by the way and so anyway

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that's how the whole thing started but

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it's not something brand new for me

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although the the level at which I looked

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into it to do the book was was new and

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what was different about it than UFOs

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was that I had spent 10 years full-time

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on UFOs and my book on that was sort of

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a culmination of all those years of work

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whereas with this new book I was

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actually learning as I went along and I

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was on a personal journey with it as

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well where I actually had experiences of

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my own and was able to witness certain

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things so it was it was a very different

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kind of a book in that way then then the

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UFO book was so started out or for you

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to find out what these experiences were

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about excuse me okay was this part in

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your quest to find out more about

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experiences you've had yeah I mean it

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was really started off as a research

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book and it's primarily a research book

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I mean it's a journalistic book I'm

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trying to present you know the best most

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credible most well tested and most

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scientific evidence for this possibility

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of survival past death just like I did

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with UFOs but the difference is that you

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can't choose to witness a UFO but in

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this field you can go to mediums you you

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might meditate and have certain

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experiences or you might go witness

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something that a physical medium can

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produce so it allows you more direct

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experiences that's the difference and

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yes I did have experiences that and I

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wrote about them in the book and I did

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try to understand them and interpret

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them as best that they could so that's

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that was part of the whole fabric of the

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investigation that I did and that's real

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different than the UFO book and it's

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very different in that way now about

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those experiences can you tell us a few

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of them maybe give us a idea of where

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you're coming from sure if that's uh I

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just want everybody to know that they

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all take place in the context of a you

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know a rigorous journalistic look at

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some of this stuff so yeah I just want

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people to know this is out of context if

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I if we start right off with the

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personal experiences which I know are

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probably a greater interest to people

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but there's a lot of research in the

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book as well just so people know that

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chapters written by experts just like

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there was with the UFO book but anyway

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my personal experiences involved some

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very extraordinary readings with mental

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mediums in which a lot of accurate very

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very accurate information came through

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and we can talk about that more if you'd

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like and I can explain what mental

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mediumship is I also have what people

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call after death communications from I

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believe to be my brother if you want to

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interpret them that way there's

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different ways you can interpret them of

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course and the other component was

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experiences with witnessing physical

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phenomena such as table move you know

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I'm tilting tables and and physical

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phenomena taking place in a seance room

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with one medium and then with a second

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medium which is how I end the book I

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think one of the most amazing physical

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mediums on the planet probably I had the

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good fortune of sitting with him for

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numerous seances what they call seances

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I know the word is sort of sounds creepy

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but and witnessing some extraordinary

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physical phenomena that I think people

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would be very fine a very it very

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difficult to believe can occur but in

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fact they can occur and I saved those

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for the end of the book because they're

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so mind-boggling that I wouldn't want to

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start off with talking about them I'm

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not sure we should start off right now

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talking about some of those things but

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so anyway those experiences were all

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mixed in with studies and research and

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other people's investigations into this

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now

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I should say that over the years we've

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tried to get a medium on the power cast

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to may be report what happened to them

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and in the rare cases we've tried you

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kind of get excuses it never seems to

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work out right but we will get into more

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of that in a moment

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we have Leslie cane the book is called

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surviving death our guest co-host is

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Erica Luke's and we were going to look

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at not just her personal journey of

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experiences but what she has learned

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about life after death with gene and

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Erica you're in the para cast we also

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have swag you know we have all these

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exclusive para cast things that you can

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buy we've got like I guess 60 or so

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different items and entails t-shirts

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sleeves for notebook computers iPad

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cases mouse pads the para cast jumbo

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tote bag all sorts of t-shirts and

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jackets and stuff like that for men and

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women we have a para cast aluminum water

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bottle all the stuff you go to stored on

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to the power cast com stored dot the

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power cast calm what makes special is

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that the items are the best quality of

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great t-shirts fabrics and they have our

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official logo on them that's what makes

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them special multiple sizes and colors

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we even have stuff for children stuff

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for women's stuff for men we have all

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sorts of sizes like small up to X large

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a lot good stuff that's the swag from

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the para cast you go to steward onto the

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para cast com stop by and take a

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shopping tour think about this your

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community's aging water infrastructure

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systems are very likely to be

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contaminated with heavy metals like lead

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disinfection chemicals like ammonia

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chlorine and chloramines and

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pharmaceuticals like statins pain meds

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and antidepressants and no water

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treatment plants are not equipped to

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filter these pharmaceutical toxins out

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protect your family's water supply with

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the trusted big berkey water filter new

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NSF EPA certified lab tests show

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berkey water filters remove chloramines

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pharmaceuticals bpa pesticides bacteria

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it's in bookstores everywhere or get our

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or big agenda for one 1.com that's big

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350
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from you if you have a comment or

351
00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:16,410
question about the para cast sent it to

352
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news at the para cast com that's news at

353
00:14:25,639 --> 00:14:23,550
the para cast calm and don't forget to

354
00:14:30,699 --> 00:14:25,649
visit our famous para cast community

355
00:14:32,780 --> 00:14:30,709
forums at forum dot the podcast.com i

356
00:14:34,069 --> 00:14:32,790
want to remind our listeners we have a

357
00:14:34,939 --> 00:14:34,079
special feature of the show which we

358
00:14:39,019 --> 00:14:34,949
mentioned briefly

359
00:14:40,910 --> 00:14:39,029
it's called para cast + and of course we

360
00:14:44,449 --> 00:14:40,920
offer the commercial free version of

361
00:14:47,989 --> 00:14:44,459
this show but we also offer a special

362
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:47,999
show called after the para cast and it's

363
00:14:52,179 --> 00:14:50,370
a mixture of different things sometimes

364
00:14:54,410 --> 00:14:52,189
it's color commentary

365
00:14:55,730 --> 00:14:54,420
sometimes it's chitchat sometimes we

366
00:14:58,579 --> 00:14:55,740
have special guests sometimes we

367
00:15:01,759 --> 00:14:58,589
continue the main show is we've sort of

368
00:15:04,610 --> 00:15:01,769
did with Erica last week and you can get

369
00:15:07,129 --> 00:15:04,620
the show if you subscribe to para cast +

370
00:15:10,850 --> 00:15:07,139
for more information go to plus PL us

371
00:15:13,730 --> 00:15:10,860
doctor para cast com+ off the power cast

372
00:15:14,540 --> 00:15:13,740
comm you get the commercial free version

373
00:15:17,509 --> 00:15:14,550
of this show

374
00:15:18,650 --> 00:15:17,519
after the power cast and more and one

375
00:15:21,799 --> 00:15:18,660
more thing before we get back with

376
00:15:24,769 --> 00:15:21,809
leslie kane a new radio station has

377
00:15:30,009 --> 00:15:24,779
joined our growing roster just got the

378
00:15:34,210 --> 00:15:30,019
word kby our radio 700 on the dial

379
00:15:37,610 --> 00:15:34,220
Anchorage Alaska how about that welcome

380
00:15:39,650 --> 00:15:37,620
Leslie we were talking briefly here

381
00:15:42,470 --> 00:15:39,660
about the fact that you have personal

382
00:15:45,079 --> 00:15:42,480
experiences you kind of hit on them

383
00:15:46,429 --> 00:15:45,089
towards more the end of the book and I

384
00:15:46,759 --> 00:15:46,439
guess that's kind of the reverse afore I

385
00:15:48,889 --> 00:15:46,769
use

386
00:15:50,629 --> 00:15:48,899
here which is that someone writes a book

387
00:15:52,429 --> 00:15:50,639
and they go into what happened to them

388
00:15:55,220 --> 00:15:52,439
and then kind of extend that to the

389
00:15:57,619 --> 00:15:55,230
research were you researching before you

390
00:15:59,299 --> 00:15:57,629
actually had an experience yeah I mean

391
00:16:01,699 --> 00:15:59,309
that's actually the case to tell you the

392
00:16:03,350 --> 00:16:01,709
truth I never expected to have the kinds

393
00:16:05,389 --> 00:16:03,360
of experiences I had although I knew

394
00:16:07,669 --> 00:16:05,399
that I would be testing mediumship I

395
00:16:09,379 --> 00:16:07,679
mean anybody can do that you can get

396
00:16:13,039 --> 00:16:09,389
readings with mediums and you can see

397
00:16:14,809 --> 00:16:13,049
how well they work I did a lot of work

398
00:16:17,929 --> 00:16:14,819
to connect with the right people who

399
00:16:19,850 --> 00:16:17,939
could connect me to the very best medium

400
00:16:21,650 --> 00:16:19,860
so at least my initial reading was

401
00:16:24,350 --> 00:16:21,660
really with a woman named Laurel in

402
00:16:26,539 --> 00:16:24,360
Jackson who has since written a book by

403
00:16:28,669 --> 00:16:26,549
the way and she would probably be

404
00:16:31,039 --> 00:16:28,679
willing to be on your show also she's

405
00:16:32,660 --> 00:16:31,049
just an outstanding mental medium and I

406
00:16:35,479 --> 00:16:32,670
was very very fortunate to get a reading

407
00:16:37,609 --> 00:16:35,489
with her and anybody could do that but

408
00:16:40,429 --> 00:16:37,619
it was only after I kind of looked into

409
00:16:42,530 --> 00:16:40,439
mental mediumship and read about it and

410
00:16:44,869 --> 00:16:42,540
looked at Studies on it and things like

411
00:16:46,819 --> 00:16:44,879
that and then I was fortunate enough

412
00:16:48,470 --> 00:16:46,829
because I had such good mediums that

413
00:16:50,539 --> 00:16:48,480
they the readings turned out to be

414
00:16:52,789 --> 00:16:50,549
really really incredible as was the

415
00:16:55,549 --> 00:16:52,799
second one I did with a medium who lives

416
00:16:57,980 --> 00:16:55,559
in Ireland who was completely unrelated

417
00:17:00,169 --> 00:16:57,990
to Laurel in Jackson in any way and both

418
00:17:02,780 --> 00:17:00,179
of them were extraordinary so I don't

419
00:17:04,399 --> 00:17:02,790
know I was I just lucked out I got two

420
00:17:06,379 --> 00:17:04,409
really good readings they made for

421
00:17:08,059 --> 00:17:06,389
excellent material in the book and they

422
00:17:09,620 --> 00:17:08,069
were mind-blowing for me because I was

423
00:17:11,750 --> 00:17:09,630
quite skeptical about all of this when I

424
00:17:13,909 --> 00:17:11,760
started I just wanted to ask you because

425
00:17:16,819 --> 00:17:13,919
this is you know in the in the world of

426
00:17:19,240 --> 00:17:16,829
UFOs that people have a hard time taking

427
00:17:23,059 --> 00:17:19,250
anything other than the nuts and bolts

428
00:17:26,120 --> 00:17:23,069
UFO experience and oftentimes the

429
00:17:28,669 --> 00:17:26,130
paranormal or some of these experiences

430
00:17:30,230 --> 00:17:28,679
are pushed aside which in my opinion is

431
00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:30,240
a disservice to what we're really

432
00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:32,970
looking at but how how has that been for

433
00:17:38,180 --> 00:17:36,090
you with dealing with the UFO community

434
00:17:38,899 --> 00:17:38,190
and now bridging over into this other

435
00:17:40,909 --> 00:17:38,909
subject

436
00:17:42,680 --> 00:17:40,919
I haven't actually dealt with this

437
00:17:45,080 --> 00:17:42,690
subject at all with the UFO community

438
00:17:47,690 --> 00:17:45,090
but I've always had great respect for

439
00:17:49,570 --> 00:17:47,700
the experiencers and you know a lot of

440
00:17:53,330 --> 00:17:49,580
the strange things that happen to them

441
00:17:54,919 --> 00:17:53,340
but actually for me personally I mean

442
00:17:57,529 --> 00:17:54,929
I'm not I haven't made that many

443
00:17:59,750 --> 00:17:57,539
connections really between this this

444
00:18:02,510 --> 00:17:59,760
investigation or this book and the pre

445
00:18:04,790 --> 00:18:02,520
this one so I know a lot of people want

446
00:18:07,940 --> 00:18:04,800
to sort of make links between these two

447
00:18:10,730 --> 00:18:07,950
fields of exploration but I personally

448
00:18:13,670 --> 00:18:10,740
haven't done that myself so I don't know

449
00:18:15,800 --> 00:18:13,680
if that's you know that that's good I

450
00:18:17,150 --> 00:18:15,810
mean for me you know when I look at some

451
00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:17,160
of the people that are studying you know

452
00:18:22,910 --> 00:18:20,250
dr. Jacque fell a kid green some of

453
00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:22,920
these people that are interested in in

454
00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:25,770
both subjects are the overlapping themes

455
00:18:30,610 --> 00:18:28,290
of all of this type of phenomena I mean

456
00:18:33,110 --> 00:18:30,620
it's interesting to see that

457
00:18:36,830 --> 00:18:33,120
unfortunately we're throwing out a lot

458
00:18:38,950 --> 00:18:36,840
of what happens to UFO witnesses or

459
00:18:42,230 --> 00:18:38,960
experiencers when there could be

460
00:18:44,960 --> 00:18:42,240
something that is a common theme between

461
00:18:46,520 --> 00:18:44,970
both you mean throwing them out the ones

462
00:18:49,310 --> 00:18:46,530
that are really weird and kind of more

463
00:18:51,110 --> 00:18:49,320
paranormal kind of get yes yeah that's

464
00:18:53,540 --> 00:18:51,120
that's a really interesting point you're

465
00:18:55,850 --> 00:18:53,550
right because I didn't deal so much with

466
00:18:58,040 --> 00:18:55,860
witnesses in my work on UFOs except for

467
00:18:59,950 --> 00:18:58,050
military people you know I was feeling

468
00:19:03,050 --> 00:18:59,960
more was sort of the concrete

469
00:19:04,940 --> 00:19:03,060
physicality of the sightings America the

470
00:19:07,340 --> 00:19:04,950
government documents and this and that

471
00:19:09,560 --> 00:19:07,350
and the radar because I was trying to

472
00:19:11,300 --> 00:19:09,570
reach a certain audience that could

473
00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:11,310
accept that kind of thing but it

474
00:19:14,810 --> 00:19:13,050
wouldn't be affected by the car and more

475
00:19:17,270 --> 00:19:14,820
paranormal aspects of it in fact they

476
00:19:18,980 --> 00:19:17,280
might even be put off by it right but it

477
00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:18,990
wasn't out of any disrespect for those

478
00:19:23,270 --> 00:19:21,210
people absolutely not it was more for

479
00:19:25,070 --> 00:19:23,280
just doing the job that I felt I was

480
00:19:27,230 --> 00:19:25,080
being called to do which was to prevent

481
00:19:29,380 --> 00:19:27,240
a certain kind of information but you're

482
00:19:32,060 --> 00:19:29,390
right it's all in the realm of sort of

483
00:19:34,790 --> 00:19:32,070
paranormal not so much the physicality

484
00:19:37,550 --> 00:19:34,800
of UFOs but the way it can affect people

485
00:19:39,680 --> 00:19:37,560
and the experiences people have had I'm

486
00:19:41,510 --> 00:19:39,690
sure a lot of them are similar okay I

487
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:41,520
want some of the things we're dealing

488
00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:44,250
with in this other area so that's a

489
00:19:47,150 --> 00:19:46,290
really interesting connection it is

490
00:19:49,250 --> 00:19:47,160
thank you

491
00:19:51,830 --> 00:19:49,260
yeah Ray's an interesting thing here

492
00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:51,840
because some months back we had red pill

493
00:19:55,520 --> 00:19:53,850
junky on the show and I don't know if

494
00:19:56,870 --> 00:19:55,530
you know him or not he's a blogger and

495
00:20:01,000 --> 00:19:56,880
the paranormal were his real name is

496
00:20:03,860 --> 00:20:01,010
Miguel and he mentioned briefly the

497
00:20:06,290 --> 00:20:03,870
possible connection at least in terms of

498
00:20:09,580 --> 00:20:06,300
the surface details between UFO

499
00:20:12,200 --> 00:20:09,590
abductions and near-death experiences

500
00:20:12,899 --> 00:20:12,210
and he were a very long editorial for

501
00:20:14,729 --> 00:20:12,909
the power

502
00:20:17,639 --> 00:20:14,739
newsletter about a quite a while back

503
00:20:20,759 --> 00:20:17,649
nog get you a link for it Leslie but if

504
00:20:22,499 --> 00:20:20,769
you had reason to think of anything like

505
00:20:22,889 --> 00:20:22,509
there's anything about that occurred to

506
00:20:27,599 --> 00:20:22,899
you

507
00:20:29,460 --> 00:20:27,609
doesn't mean it's not valid I just

508
00:20:31,919 --> 00:20:29,470
haven't put my mind there you know

509
00:20:33,839 --> 00:20:31,929
because abductions were never my focus

510
00:20:35,369 --> 00:20:33,849
either when it came to UFOs I mean it

511
00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:35,379
knows something about them but I was

512
00:20:39,930 --> 00:20:37,570
never focused on them oh I don't feel I

513
00:20:41,849 --> 00:20:39,940
have any expertise on them but I've

514
00:20:43,379 --> 00:20:41,859
heard other people make that connection

515
00:20:46,680 --> 00:20:43,389
that somehow there's a connection

516
00:20:48,960 --> 00:20:46,690
between some kind of afterlife realm and

517
00:20:52,109 --> 00:20:48,970
the abductions I just heard it said

518
00:20:53,729 --> 00:20:52,119
before but I've never I've never focused

519
00:20:56,580 --> 00:20:53,739
on it myself I really don't feel

520
00:20:58,849 --> 00:20:56,590
qualified to that's kind of interesting

521
00:21:02,460 --> 00:20:58,859
here you know that you know obviously

522
00:21:03,690 --> 00:21:02,470
you of course were associated for a

523
00:21:09,389 --> 00:21:03,700
number of years with a very well known

524
00:21:11,249 --> 00:21:09,399
abduction researcher Budd Hopkins in the

525
00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:11,259
field but even when I was friends with

526
00:21:16,589 --> 00:21:13,210
bud I wasn't focused so much on that

527
00:21:18,749 --> 00:21:16,599
area of work so you know that was his

528
00:21:21,509 --> 00:21:18,759
area of work and I found it fascinating

529
00:21:24,989 --> 00:21:21,519
but I wasn't didn't I never gained any

530
00:21:26,969 --> 00:21:24,999
expertise in it per se by the way

531
00:21:28,889 --> 00:21:26,979
listeners if you want to check the power

532
00:21:35,430 --> 00:21:28,899
cast newsletter has the article from red

533
00:21:39,089 --> 00:21:35,440
pill chunky it's August 23rd 2015 and I

534
00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:39,099
asked him to write this piece and ended

535
00:21:46,979 --> 00:21:42,129
up being I think four or five thousand

536
00:21:49,919 --> 00:21:46,989
words showing the various aspects of the

537
00:21:51,719 --> 00:21:49,929
two that came together all right

538
00:21:53,190 --> 00:21:51,729
let's go back to the mediums again

539
00:21:56,549 --> 00:21:53,200
because I mentioned briefly and never

540
00:21:58,320 --> 00:21:56,559
really pursued it that we have tried on

541
00:21:59,669 --> 00:21:58,330
occasion with the power cast to get a

542
00:22:03,119 --> 00:21:59,679
medium to come on the show and

543
00:22:07,529 --> 00:22:03,129
demonstrate to us you know whether they

544
00:22:09,629 --> 00:22:07,539
had something to say and I guess the

545
00:22:15,149 --> 00:22:09,639
skeptical impression of a medium is that

546
00:22:18,419 --> 00:22:15,159
they use cold readings kind of just say

547
00:22:19,859 --> 00:22:18,429
the things you want to hear and because

548
00:22:21,779 --> 00:22:19,869
they're saying the things they think you

549
00:22:24,119 --> 00:22:21,789
want to hear they seem all the more

550
00:22:26,700 --> 00:22:24,129
impressive and what they do so maybe you

551
00:22:29,039 --> 00:22:26,710
can tell us maybe a few specific

552
00:22:30,360 --> 00:22:29,049
examples where a medium gave you

553
00:22:34,430 --> 00:22:30,370
something that really knocked your socks

554
00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:34,440
off we're talking to Leslie Kane and

555
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she's author of a book called surviving

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00:22:41,450 --> 00:22:39,520
death a journalist investigates evidence

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00:22:45,269 --> 00:22:41,460
for an afterlife

558
00:22:57,810 --> 00:22:45,279
Erica Lucas is our guest co-host you're

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00:22:57,820 --> 00:23:02,820
thank you for listening to GCN

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hi this is James Fox from chasing UFOs

644
00:27:24,610 --> 00:27:17,690
you're listening to the podcast the gold

645
00:27:27,700 --> 00:27:24,620
standard of paranormal radio so Lesley

646
00:27:30,580 --> 00:27:27,710
Cain author of surviving death can you

647
00:27:32,710 --> 00:27:30,590
tell us one or two tales of a medium who

648
00:27:35,950 --> 00:27:32,720
really came up with stuff that really

649
00:27:38,530 --> 00:27:35,960
astounded you yeah and I do I wanted to

650
00:27:41,380 --> 00:27:38,540
just comment on the fact that there are

651
00:27:42,940 --> 00:27:41,390
of course lots of fraudulent mediums out

652
00:27:46,060 --> 00:27:42,950
there people that use cold reading

653
00:27:48,100 --> 00:27:46,070
techniques people that have all kinds of

654
00:27:50,890 --> 00:27:48,110
ways of fooling people

655
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:50,900
and providing generalities and picking

656
00:27:55,150 --> 00:27:52,850
up cues from them and all kinds of

657
00:27:58,030 --> 00:27:55,160
techniques to make people believe that

658
00:27:59,680 --> 00:27:58,040
they're contacting their dead relative

659
00:28:01,240 --> 00:27:59,690
but there are ways you can eliminate

660
00:28:03,490 --> 00:28:01,250
that and make it an absolute

661
00:28:05,980 --> 00:28:03,500
impossibility for that to be occurring

662
00:28:08,500 --> 00:28:05,990
what I did with my readings was they

663
00:28:10,150 --> 00:28:08,510
were done over the phone first of all so

664
00:28:12,340 --> 00:28:10,160
there's no visual cues for the medium

665
00:28:14,620 --> 00:28:12,350
second of all what's really important is

666
00:28:16,390 --> 00:28:14,630
that the medium knows nothing about who

667
00:28:18,700 --> 00:28:16,400
you are let's call the person getting

668
00:28:21,100 --> 00:28:18,710
the reading is called the sitter so in

669
00:28:24,220 --> 00:28:21,110
my situation you you don't give them any

670
00:28:26,290 --> 00:28:24,230
information not even your name so for

671
00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:26,300
the second reading that I did this this

672
00:28:33,370 --> 00:28:29,650
medium was in Ireland I took out a

673
00:28:35,260 --> 00:28:33,380
PayPal account under a phony name I took

674
00:28:38,050 --> 00:28:35,270
out a whole separate email address under

675
00:28:39,730 --> 00:28:38,060
a phony name and I used the PayPal

676
00:28:42,490 --> 00:28:39,740
account to pay for her phony email

677
00:28:45,340 --> 00:28:42,500
address and I gave her my first name

678
00:28:47,950 --> 00:28:45,350
only last name was a phony name

679
00:28:49,630 --> 00:28:47,960
and she knew absolutely nothing about me

680
00:28:52,330 --> 00:28:49,640
she had no idea where in the whole

681
00:28:52,810 --> 00:28:52,340
planet that I lived she didn't even know

682
00:28:56,800 --> 00:28:52,820
my name

683
00:28:58,900 --> 00:28:56,810
nothing so when you doing a reading like

684
00:29:00,910 --> 00:28:58,910
that and you're not even physical

685
00:29:02,470 --> 00:29:00,920
proximity to that person there is no way

686
00:29:04,780 --> 00:29:02,480
they can use these kinds of techniques

687
00:29:07,030 --> 00:29:04,790
or they if they try they're not gonna

688
00:29:09,700 --> 00:29:07,040
have a very good reading so when you sit

689
00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:09,710
down in a situation like that and the

690
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:13,010
person is able to provide accurate

691
00:29:17,290 --> 00:29:14,930
personal details that they say are

692
00:29:20,260 --> 00:29:17,300
coming from a deceased person that you

693
00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:20,270
knew that no one else except you and

694
00:29:24,580 --> 00:29:23,330
maybe two family members even know you

695
00:29:26,050 --> 00:29:24,590
know it's very come

696
00:29:28,270 --> 00:29:26,060
this is the kind of reading that means

697
00:29:30,460 --> 00:29:28,280
something it doesn't mean anything when

698
00:29:32,380 --> 00:29:30,470
you're in a big room you know and you're

699
00:29:33,820 --> 00:29:32,390
on a TV show or something where they can

700
00:29:36,730 --> 00:29:33,830
use these other kinds of techniques that

701
00:29:39,010 --> 00:29:36,740
that are so dangerous for people that

702
00:29:41,170 --> 00:29:39,020
take advantage of people's grief to to

703
00:29:43,510 --> 00:29:41,180
try to fool them but when you're a

704
00:29:45,310 --> 00:29:43,520
student you can eliminate those kinds of

705
00:29:48,550 --> 00:29:45,320
problems and there are investigators

706
00:29:49,990 --> 00:29:48,560
that do these studies with mediums and

707
00:29:53,650 --> 00:29:50,000
I'm one of them wrote a chapter in my

708
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:53,660
book in which they provide no numerous

709
00:29:58,890 --> 00:29:56,570
levels of blinding for the medium so

710
00:30:03,100 --> 00:29:58,900
they can't possibly use those techniques

711
00:30:06,130 --> 00:30:03,110
anyway so I when I had the experience of

712
00:30:08,350 --> 00:30:06,140
a reading with this medium from Ireland

713
00:30:11,290 --> 00:30:08,360
for instance who knew absolutely nothing

714
00:30:13,690 --> 00:30:11,300
about me and she provided probably 90%

715
00:30:16,390 --> 00:30:13,700
accuracy of information which is

716
00:30:18,100 --> 00:30:16,400
extremely high and a lot of it was

717
00:30:20,800 --> 00:30:18,110
personal information that nobody else

718
00:30:22,690 --> 00:30:20,810
knew about two people who I knew very

719
00:30:25,750 --> 00:30:22,700
well in my life who had died recently

720
00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:25,760
and that's that's what I described in

721
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:27,770
the book and I actually give the some of

722
00:30:31,950 --> 00:30:29,930
the specifics that she gave me and try

723
00:30:34,930 --> 00:30:31,960
to figure out a way of explaining this

724
00:30:37,810 --> 00:30:34,940
can you be specific without obviously

725
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:37,820
revealing any personal details of what

726
00:30:42,460 --> 00:30:40,730
yes a medium right I reveal personal

727
00:30:43,870 --> 00:30:42,470
details in the book I just kind of don't

728
00:30:45,850 --> 00:30:43,880
want to give them all away ahead of time

729
00:30:46,630 --> 00:30:45,860
but one of the people that came through

730
00:30:48,790 --> 00:30:46,640
was my brother

731
00:30:50,530 --> 00:30:48,800
and let's just I'm gonna say it as if it

732
00:30:52,780 --> 00:30:50,540
happened you know I'm just gonna not

733
00:30:54,760 --> 00:30:52,790
quite qualifying that who ostensibly

734
00:30:56,050 --> 00:30:54,770
came through or allegedly came through

735
00:30:58,390 --> 00:30:56,060
and be like that well let's just talk

736
00:30:59,830 --> 00:30:58,400
about it as if it happened that way

737
00:31:01,750 --> 00:30:59,840
because there are other ways of

738
00:31:04,030 --> 00:31:01,760
explaining it which I can discuss too

739
00:31:06,070 --> 00:31:04,040
but one of them was my brother Theo was

740
00:31:08,340 --> 00:31:06,080
my Fred but my friend Budd Hopkins so

741
00:31:11,350 --> 00:31:08,350
you mentioned earlier the well-known

742
00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:11,360
abduction researcher who died in 2011

743
00:31:19,510 --> 00:31:15,770
and the interest in so some of the

744
00:31:20,860 --> 00:31:19,520
specific facts that came through were

745
00:31:24,280 --> 00:31:20,870
all kinds of things about their lives

746
00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:24,290
their careers their families there was

747
00:31:30,550 --> 00:31:28,010
one particular line that the medium gave

748
00:31:34,600 --> 00:31:30,560
over the guards to Budd which absolutely

749
00:31:37,730 --> 00:31:34,610
gave me chills which was the first thing

750
00:31:40,790 --> 00:31:37,740
that he said when he came through

751
00:31:43,910 --> 00:31:40,800
you were right you were right and he was

752
00:31:46,310 --> 00:31:43,920
very aggressive in his manifestation of

753
00:31:48,440 --> 00:31:46,320
his personality very outgoing very

754
00:31:50,300 --> 00:31:48,450
self-centered just the way but was in

755
00:31:51,050 --> 00:31:50,310
real life I mean his personality came

756
00:31:53,540 --> 00:31:51,060
through too

757
00:31:55,430 --> 00:31:53,550
the interesting thing about that just to

758
00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:55,440
keep it brief is that I had given him

759
00:31:59,150 --> 00:31:57,210
some books to read right before he died

760
00:32:03,140 --> 00:31:59,160
within the last six months before he

761
00:32:04,850 --> 00:32:03,150
died about this topic I thought he might

762
00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:04,860
be interested in knowing that there is

763
00:32:09,380 --> 00:32:06,570
evidence that suggests that maybe death

764
00:32:11,420 --> 00:32:09,390
isn't the end and I brought over these

765
00:32:14,180 --> 00:32:11,430
books to him I carefully selected them

766
00:32:15,830 --> 00:32:14,190
one of them was about Ian Stevenson who

767
00:32:17,870 --> 00:32:15,840
I thought he would identify with who was

768
00:32:20,390 --> 00:32:17,880
a great investigator into child

769
00:32:22,370 --> 00:32:20,400
reincarnation cases and he's very

770
00:32:23,660 --> 00:32:22,380
curious and he was a reader so I thought

771
00:32:25,670 --> 00:32:23,670
for sure you'd be interested in these

772
00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:25,680
things but he when it came back later

773
00:32:28,940 --> 00:32:27,810
next couple of days he told me he didn't

774
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:28,950
want to read them he wasn't interested

775
00:32:33,710 --> 00:32:31,890
no I don't want to read these you know I

776
00:32:35,750 --> 00:32:33,720
know that that death is the end and

777
00:32:38,030 --> 00:32:35,760
that's it and I was really surprised

778
00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:38,040
because he usually is curious to read

779
00:32:44,270 --> 00:32:40,770
stuff so anyway when he said that I knew

780
00:32:47,450 --> 00:32:44,280
immediately what he meant and then the

781
00:32:50,570 --> 00:32:47,460
medium actually said that she understood

782
00:32:52,010 --> 00:32:50,580
that to mean what I thought it meant so

783
00:32:53,510 --> 00:32:52,020
it's when they come up with very

784
00:32:55,330 --> 00:32:53,520
personal things like that that nobody

785
00:32:58,310 --> 00:32:55,340
else knows about that you're really um

786
00:33:00,680 --> 00:32:58,320
struck but she also provided a lot of

787
00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:00,690
specific details about his life that

788
00:33:06,920 --> 00:33:02,850
could just were just facts about his

789
00:33:09,370 --> 00:33:06,930
life and anyway that's I don't know if

790
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:09,380
that's answering your question but um

791
00:33:14,420 --> 00:33:11,970
it's very compelling when it happens in

792
00:33:16,130 --> 00:33:14,430
the moment and especially when you can

793
00:33:20,780 --> 00:33:16,140
feel the personality of that person

794
00:33:24,830 --> 00:33:20,790
their little quirky things about the

795
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:24,840
person that seem to come through but

796
00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:26,610
there are other ways that this can be

797
00:33:30,890 --> 00:33:28,770
explained other than being the actual

798
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:30,900
dead person there so that's something

799
00:33:34,220 --> 00:33:32,730
else that I explained in the book there

800
00:33:36,620 --> 00:33:34,230
are other ways of interpreting these

801
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:36,630
kinds of experiences that come through

802
00:33:41,540 --> 00:33:40,290
mediumship quickly obviously you want

803
00:33:43,310 --> 00:33:41,550
people to read the book but maybe give

804
00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:43,320
us a quick overview of the other

805
00:33:47,660 --> 00:33:45,810
possible explanations yeah I mean and I

806
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:47,670
do I deal with this theme throughout the

807
00:33:51,340 --> 00:33:49,650
book which is what the current debate is

808
00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:51,350
among people who are dealing

809
00:33:56,490 --> 00:33:53,570
with this information is what they call

810
00:33:59,110 --> 00:33:56,500
the sigh hi Pappas's whether these

811
00:34:01,750 --> 00:33:59,120
experiences can be explained as

812
00:34:04,870 --> 00:34:01,760
resulting from just the very

813
00:34:07,180 --> 00:34:04,880
sophisticated refined psychic abilities

814
00:34:09,240 --> 00:34:07,190
of the medium which would which would

815
00:34:13,720 --> 00:34:09,250
mean that she would be using her

816
00:34:15,270 --> 00:34:13,730
telepathy and her clairvoyance but most

817
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:15,280
it would be telepathy her ability to

818
00:34:21,399 --> 00:34:19,010
pick up from me the information that she

819
00:34:24,669 --> 00:34:21,409
that then comes through her or if it's

820
00:34:26,470 --> 00:34:24,679
something I don't know as the sitter the

821
00:34:28,899 --> 00:34:26,480
claim is that these mediums can pick up

822
00:34:32,020 --> 00:34:28,909
information elsewhere through from a

823
00:34:33,970 --> 00:34:32,030
distant family member or they can read

824
00:34:35,470 --> 00:34:33,980
some kind of a document somewhere with

825
00:34:37,599 --> 00:34:35,480
their clairvoyance or they can know

826
00:34:40,240 --> 00:34:37,609
where something is hidden away that and

827
00:34:42,580 --> 00:34:40,250
then tell you that oh your dad is saying

828
00:34:44,859 --> 00:34:42,590
that the will you can't find is buried

829
00:34:46,930 --> 00:34:44,869
in the basement and there it is now that

830
00:34:49,030 --> 00:34:46,940
could be the mediums clairvoyants as

831
00:34:52,090 --> 00:34:49,040
opposed to a dead person talking through

832
00:34:54,399 --> 00:34:52,100
her or her information about Budd could

833
00:34:56,530 --> 00:34:54,409
have been coming from her ability to

834
00:34:58,960 --> 00:34:56,540
pick it up through her telepathy and if

835
00:35:01,420 --> 00:34:58,970
that's the case there's no dead person

836
00:35:03,130 --> 00:35:01,430
involved so that's the other explanation

837
00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:03,140
for the possibility of what's going on

838
00:35:09,550 --> 00:35:05,810
here but in either case you have to be

839
00:35:12,220 --> 00:35:09,560
willing to accept the very amazing and

840
00:35:14,620 --> 00:35:12,230
advanced psychic abilities that are

841
00:35:16,150 --> 00:35:14,630
involved with mediumship regardless of

842
00:35:16,480 --> 00:35:16,160
whether they're a dead person or a human

843
00:35:19,330 --> 00:35:16,490
being

844
00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:19,340
they there's no other you cannot deny

845
00:35:25,810 --> 00:35:24,050
the reality of sine psi and I think

846
00:35:28,150 --> 00:35:25,820
there are many scientists and many

847
00:35:30,760 --> 00:35:28,160
people skeptics that deny that it's even

848
00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:30,770
exists that's that sigh is even possible

849
00:35:34,570 --> 00:35:33,170
that psychic abilities even exist in

850
00:35:37,090 --> 00:35:34,580
human beings and that to me is

851
00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:37,100
absolutely absurd because of the things

852
00:35:41,260 --> 00:35:39,650
that I've witnessed and experienced but

853
00:35:43,510 --> 00:35:41,270
I can't prove that there were dead

854
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:43,520
people but they certainly involved in

855
00:35:48,280 --> 00:35:45,530
very advanced psychic abilities no

856
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:48,290
matter what the root of them was because

857
00:35:52,330 --> 00:35:49,970
that's incredible and I've been you know

858
00:35:56,500 --> 00:35:52,340
I'm a member of the SSC and I there are

859
00:35:59,590 --> 00:35:56,510
lots of wonderful lots of wonderful

860
00:36:03,020 --> 00:35:59,600
research done on the side phenomena and

861
00:36:06,590 --> 00:36:03,030
life after death near-death experiences

862
00:36:08,570 --> 00:36:06,600
and mediumship and so it's it's fun to

863
00:36:11,030 --> 00:36:08,580
hear you talk about all of these things

864
00:36:13,160 --> 00:36:11,040
and I have to ask you when you were when

865
00:36:16,370 --> 00:36:13,170
you got into really researching this who

866
00:36:18,290 --> 00:36:16,380
were some of the the people that you

867
00:36:21,710 --> 00:36:18,300
found most intriguing or most

868
00:36:25,220 --> 00:36:21,720
informative with regard to this man in

869
00:36:27,980 --> 00:36:25,230
terms of investigators well and people

870
00:36:30,190 --> 00:36:27,990
that you could learn from I mean in

871
00:36:32,570 --> 00:36:30,200
people yeah that would be wonderful

872
00:36:35,660 --> 00:36:32,580
before you do that answer let's do a

873
00:36:38,210 --> 00:36:35,670
break and then come back with Leslie's

874
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:38,220
response to Erica Luke's question this

875
00:36:42,950 --> 00:36:40,770
week Erica is our guest co-host Chris

876
00:36:45,020 --> 00:36:42,960
O'Brien is on special assignment

877
00:36:46,790 --> 00:36:45,030
elsewhere and will quite possibly be

878
00:36:48,950 --> 00:36:46,800
back for this week's episode of after

879
00:36:58,830 --> 00:36:48,960
the power cast so with gene and with

880
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00:41:21,210 --> 00:41:17,950
that's 877 878 4203 this is actually you

960
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:21,220
listening to the podcast the gold

961
00:41:39,670 --> 00:41:37,330
the book is surviving death the author

962
00:41:42,940 --> 00:41:39,680
is Leslie Kane and our guest co-host

963
00:41:44,710 --> 00:41:42,950
erica luke's asked Leslie a question at

964
00:41:46,930 --> 00:41:44,720
the end of our previous segment Leslie

965
00:41:49,150 --> 00:41:46,940
her response yeah I mean there were so

966
00:41:50,830 --> 00:41:49,160
many wonderful people who have been

967
00:41:53,140 --> 00:41:50,840
working on this for decades one of the

968
00:41:54,730 --> 00:41:53,150
people that impressed me a lot was dr.

969
00:41:57,070 --> 00:41:54,740
Jim Tucker from the University of

970
00:41:58,900 --> 00:41:57,080
Virginia he's actually successor Ian

971
00:42:01,450 --> 00:41:58,910
Stevenson has been instant studying

972
00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:01,460
cases of children very very young

973
00:42:06,130 --> 00:42:04,010
children with past life memories he

974
00:42:08,860 --> 00:42:06,140
actually wrote a chapter in my book of

975
00:42:11,650 --> 00:42:08,870
his own and then PIM van Lommel I also

976
00:42:13,810 --> 00:42:11,660
loved him loved his work he also wrote a

977
00:42:16,570 --> 00:42:13,820
chapter in my book Peter fennec who

978
00:42:19,030 --> 00:42:16,580
studies end of life experiences Julie

979
00:42:22,150 --> 00:42:19,040
bycel from the Windridge Institute which

980
00:42:23,500 --> 00:42:22,160
is a Study Center actually in Arizona I

981
00:42:25,330 --> 00:42:23,510
don't know maybe Jane's heard of it

982
00:42:27,220 --> 00:42:25,340
where they they do a lot of studies of

983
00:42:28,930 --> 00:42:27,230
mental mediumship there and other things

984
00:42:32,620 --> 00:42:28,940
there were a bunch of British

985
00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:32,630
investigators Alan Gould is a famous in

986
00:42:35,950 --> 00:42:33,970
this field he's very famous

987
00:42:38,220 --> 00:42:35,960
distinguished gentleman has been doing

988
00:42:41,530 --> 00:42:38,230
this stuff for probably 50 years written

989
00:42:42,910 --> 00:42:41,540
excellent you know landmark books so

990
00:42:44,170 --> 00:42:42,920
there's a whole lot of people Lloyd our

991
00:42:47,230 --> 00:42:44,180
backs I don't know if you've ever had

992
00:42:48,700 --> 00:42:47,240
him on the show we had yeah he's a great

993
00:42:50,740 --> 00:42:48,710
guy very entertaining

994
00:42:52,540 --> 00:42:50,750
he wrote a chapter my book about

995
00:42:55,090 --> 00:42:52,550
apparitions and investigation of

996
00:42:57,790 --> 00:42:55,100
apparitions which is just fantastic and

997
00:43:00,190 --> 00:42:57,800
I absolutely admire Erlander haraldson

998
00:43:03,100 --> 00:43:00,200
who's another elderly gentleman like

999
00:43:06,190 --> 00:43:03,110
Alan goal to us I guess you say it air

1000
00:43:07,630 --> 00:43:06,200
Linder he's from Iceland and he's a PhD

1001
00:43:10,270 --> 00:43:07,640
psychologist and he's been studying

1002
00:43:13,450 --> 00:43:10,280
these kinds of phenomena a range of them

1003
00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:13,460
for probably 50 years as well many many

1004
00:43:19,090 --> 00:43:16,130
books and he wrote a fascinating chapter

1005
00:43:20,830 --> 00:43:19,100
in my book about a physical medium an

1006
00:43:22,330 --> 00:43:20,840
Icelandic physical medium and not many

1007
00:43:24,820 --> 00:43:22,340
people know about it was absolutely

1008
00:43:26,860 --> 00:43:24,830
amazing so anyway those are just some

1009
00:43:28,030 --> 00:43:26,870
people there are there others I mean

1010
00:43:30,310 --> 00:43:28,040
there there are also lots of

1011
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:30,320
investigators who wrote books in the

1012
00:43:35,140 --> 00:43:32,810
past who I admire a lot who aren't with

1013
00:43:37,210 --> 00:43:35,150
us anymore I'm gonna post some of these

1014
00:43:39,190 --> 00:43:37,220
research papers and these studies and

1015
00:43:41,650 --> 00:43:39,200
interesting videos and so on on my

1016
00:43:43,150 --> 00:43:41,660
website by the way so people who reading

1017
00:43:45,430 --> 00:43:43,160
the book and get

1018
00:43:46,600 --> 00:43:45,440
more information and they can supplement

1019
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:46,610
what they're reading with some

1020
00:43:51,130 --> 00:43:48,890
additional material and just so people

1021
00:43:53,650 --> 00:43:51,140
know my website is surviving death cane

1022
00:43:57,070 --> 00:43:53,660
that's my the book title and my name ke

1023
00:43:59,140 --> 00:43:57,080
am surviving death cane calm we have

1024
00:44:02,140 --> 00:43:59,150
that link by the way in our description

1025
00:44:05,020 --> 00:44:02,150
of the show over the power cast calm so

1026
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:05,030
this way if you forget it we always try

1027
00:44:09,940 --> 00:44:07,130
to put the guests links somewhere

1028
00:44:12,430 --> 00:44:09,950
there's so many references in there to

1029
00:44:14,350 --> 00:44:12,440
the materials that were useful to me as

1030
00:44:15,670 --> 00:44:14,360
an investigator and as a journalist I

1031
00:44:18,310 --> 00:44:15,680
mean there's so much great information

1032
00:44:19,540 --> 00:44:18,320
and other than the people I mentioned it

1033
00:44:21,460 --> 00:44:19,550
would be hard for me off the top of my

1034
00:44:24,490 --> 00:44:21,470
head made the studies of rachet and

1035
00:44:26,770 --> 00:44:24,500
jelly from France who did studies on

1036
00:44:29,290 --> 00:44:26,780
mental mediumship in the 1920s and 30s

1037
00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:29,300
there's I could spend half an hour

1038
00:44:32,620 --> 00:44:30,890
giving you a lot a bunch of names that

1039
00:44:34,960 --> 00:44:32,630
people probably haven't heard of but I'm

1040
00:44:36,370 --> 00:44:34,970
going to post as I said they're all be

1041
00:44:38,680 --> 00:44:36,380
on my website I want people to have

1042
00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:38,690
access to some of this great material I

1043
00:44:42,730 --> 00:44:40,490
just hope people will go there cuz

1044
00:44:45,220 --> 00:44:42,740
that's where it'll be absolutely I know

1045
00:44:47,290 --> 00:44:45,230
I will and I will post that to all of my

1046
00:44:50,260 --> 00:44:47,300
friends and followers so I think this is

1047
00:44:52,210 --> 00:44:50,270
really important I love that and I want

1048
00:44:54,340 --> 00:44:52,220
to ask you too with regard to the

1049
00:44:56,610 --> 00:44:54,350
physical mediumship we've got the

1050
00:45:00,370 --> 00:44:56,620
typical type of things that you'll hear

1051
00:45:03,190 --> 00:45:00,380
binocs different things taking place the

1052
00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:03,200
anomalous light phenomena that is is

1053
00:45:11,230 --> 00:45:07,210
present sometimes ectoplasm levitation

1054
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:11,240
so I did witness Eric some phenomenal

1055
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:13,370
things in physical mediumship it's very

1056
00:45:17,170 --> 00:45:15,410
hard to talk about them out of context I

1057
00:45:19,210 --> 00:45:17,180
you know because in the book I build

1058
00:45:21,940 --> 00:45:19,220
people up to them very gradually and I

1059
00:45:24,700 --> 00:45:21,950
show them how scientists have studied

1060
00:45:26,710 --> 00:45:24,710
these things and I give some examples of

1061
00:45:29,350 --> 00:45:26,720
situations where they've been proven to

1062
00:45:31,150 --> 00:45:29,360
exist under extremely rigorously

1063
00:45:34,630 --> 00:45:31,160
controlled conditions so that they're

1064
00:45:36,610 --> 00:45:34,640
sort of prepared to handle it right so

1065
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:36,620
just want people to know when they hear

1066
00:45:42,640 --> 00:45:40,210
how ridiculous it sounds they need to

1067
00:45:43,930 --> 00:45:42,650
read the book and and I think they'll

1068
00:45:46,690 --> 00:45:43,940
feel differently about it when they do

1069
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:46,700
that because it it's just difficult to

1070
00:45:51,760 --> 00:45:48,290
take it out of context but I will do it

1071
00:45:54,640 --> 00:45:51,770
because it's real and I'm I be happy to

1072
00:45:56,580 --> 00:45:54,650
talk about it I just you understand how

1073
00:46:00,330 --> 00:45:56,590
it way absolutely

1074
00:46:02,100 --> 00:46:00,340
and I and I I appreciate that you

1075
00:46:04,470 --> 00:46:02,110
wanting to set the stage and make sure

1076
00:46:06,750 --> 00:46:04,480
that people understand that your work is

1077
00:46:09,030 --> 00:46:06,760
methodical and and you know you're

1078
00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:09,040
trying to I mean you're very rational

1079
00:46:13,530 --> 00:46:11,890
and you're trying to rule out all of the

1080
00:46:15,510 --> 00:46:13,540
the hoaxes and different things that

1081
00:46:17,100 --> 00:46:15,520
could take place but you this is

1082
00:46:20,910 --> 00:46:17,110
something that you you're very diligent

1083
00:46:23,220 --> 00:46:20,920
about exactly and I think that by the

1084
00:46:25,890 --> 00:46:23,230
time people get to the section where I

1085
00:46:27,540 --> 00:46:25,900
talk about my own experiences of

1086
00:46:29,370 --> 00:46:27,550
physical mediumship I hope that they

1087
00:46:32,400 --> 00:46:29,380
will realize that understand that I've

1088
00:46:35,580 --> 00:46:32,410
taken all precautions and I know how to

1089
00:46:36,750 --> 00:46:35,590
discern like you know a fraudulent case

1090
00:46:38,850 --> 00:46:36,760
from one that isn't

1091
00:46:41,430 --> 00:46:38,860
and I think exploit all the things in

1092
00:46:43,170 --> 00:46:41,440
the book that all the reasons that I

1093
00:46:45,750 --> 00:46:43,180
know that this particular medium his

1094
00:46:47,310 --> 00:46:45,760
name is Stewart Alexander is is not a

1095
00:46:49,110 --> 00:46:47,320
fraud there's absolutely no question

1096
00:46:51,090 --> 00:46:49,120
about it for many reasons which I

1097
00:46:52,620 --> 00:46:51,100
described in the book but I won't bore

1098
00:46:56,160 --> 00:46:52,630
people with it now I just hope that

1099
00:46:57,780 --> 00:46:56,170
people will you know read it not because

1100
00:46:59,520 --> 00:46:57,790
I'm trying to sell books I just want

1101
00:47:03,480 --> 00:46:59,530
people to understand the context for

1102
00:47:04,830 --> 00:47:03,490
this because it's so strange and the

1103
00:47:08,310 --> 00:47:04,840
only way they can really understand the

1104
00:47:09,750 --> 00:47:08,320
context is to read more about it so and

1105
00:47:11,310 --> 00:47:09,760
I want to just sorry to interrupt you

1106
00:47:15,450 --> 00:47:11,320
but I wanted to say that I think people

1107
00:47:17,880 --> 00:47:15,460
that are rational and understand your

1108
00:47:20,730 --> 00:47:17,890
diligent approach and also understand

1109
00:47:23,100 --> 00:47:20,740
the importance of work that you see at

1110
00:47:25,800 --> 00:47:23,110
the scientific society for scientific

1111
00:47:27,840 --> 00:47:25,810
exploration I mean all of these people

1112
00:47:30,960 --> 00:47:27,850
are taking this very seriously and these

1113
00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:30,970
are PhDs and people that are engaged in

1114
00:47:39,660 --> 00:47:35,530
it in very serious research so as as you

1115
00:47:41,070 --> 00:47:39,670
are as well yeah I mean there are then I

1116
00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:41,080
try those are the kinds of people I've

1117
00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:42,610
tried to draw into hope who have

1118
00:47:46,020 --> 00:47:44,530
contributed to my book who have written

1119
00:47:48,360 --> 00:47:46,030
some chapters in it and who I've

1120
00:47:51,120 --> 00:47:48,370
interviewed a lot with and stuff so I

1121
00:47:54,390 --> 00:47:51,130
think we've covered that you know

1122
00:47:57,600 --> 00:47:54,400
covered that for the listeners but so

1123
00:48:00,840 --> 00:47:57,610
and you know physical mediumship is

1124
00:48:02,490 --> 00:48:00,850
there are plenty of frauds out there and

1125
00:48:05,150 --> 00:48:02,500
if there were plenty of frauds back in

1126
00:48:07,980 --> 00:48:05,160
the heyday in the 1920s and the 1910s

1127
00:48:08,690 --> 00:48:07,990
but there were also some just like there

1128
00:48:11,690 --> 00:48:08,700
are some

1129
00:48:14,420 --> 00:48:11,700
genuine UFO cases there were and are

1130
00:48:17,660 --> 00:48:14,430
genuine physical mediums and you just

1131
00:48:21,020 --> 00:48:17,670
have to be rigorous about discerning who

1132
00:48:24,980 --> 00:48:21,030
they are but the one who I believe is

1133
00:48:27,260 --> 00:48:24,990
probably the most significant one in the

1134
00:48:28,640 --> 00:48:27,270
world today is Phil is Stuart Alexander

1135
00:48:31,280 --> 00:48:28,650
who I write about in my book he's he

1136
00:48:33,530 --> 00:48:31,290
lives in the UK and he's been practicing

1137
00:48:37,460 --> 00:48:33,540
with a small group of people for about

1138
00:48:39,049 --> 00:48:37,470
forty years the same small group not

1139
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:39,059
interested in publicity he's very

1140
00:48:45,380 --> 00:48:43,410
private about it but he was welcoming to

1141
00:48:47,270 --> 00:48:45,390
me when I finally met him after great

1142
00:48:48,470 --> 00:48:47,280
hesitation he was hesitant at first to

1143
00:48:50,720 --> 00:48:48,480
get involved with this book or anything

1144
00:48:53,569 --> 00:48:50,730
but gradually it evolved that he became

1145
00:48:55,849 --> 00:48:53,579
comfortable with me and sitting with his

1146
00:49:00,230 --> 00:48:55,859
small group in this little room in

1147
00:49:02,390 --> 00:49:00,240
England I was privileged to witness I

1148
00:49:04,190 --> 00:49:02,400
mean a lot of it is in the dark and we

1149
00:49:06,410 --> 00:49:04,200
have you know my book I explain all

1150
00:49:09,410 --> 00:49:06,420
about why there is this need for

1151
00:49:11,299 --> 00:49:09,420
darkness that a lot of mediums feel that

1152
00:49:14,000 --> 00:49:11,309
they need it for various reasons I'm not

1153
00:49:15,650 --> 00:49:14,010
going to go into that now but it's sort

1154
00:49:19,210 --> 00:49:15,660
of a tradition with physical mediumship

1155
00:49:23,599 --> 00:49:19,220
but not all of it and I did witness

1156
00:49:27,950 --> 00:49:23,609
levitations and independent voices that

1157
00:49:29,900 --> 00:49:27,960
speak out of the air matter going

1158
00:49:32,030 --> 00:49:29,910
through matter but the most

1159
00:49:35,930 --> 00:49:32,040
extraordinary thing of all that I

1160
00:49:37,970 --> 00:49:35,940
witnessed and actually saw because they

1161
00:49:40,579 --> 00:49:37,980
the light was on for this was the

1162
00:49:44,120 --> 00:49:40,589
materialization of the physical human

1163
00:49:46,460 --> 00:49:44,130
hand from the substance called ectoplasm

1164
00:49:49,640 --> 00:49:46,470
which is a substance that's exude from

1165
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:49,650
the medium and there was a light on for

1166
00:49:53,569 --> 00:49:51,450
this so I not only witnessed this

1167
00:49:56,299 --> 00:49:53,579
formation of this hand out of nothing

1168
00:49:59,930 --> 00:49:56,309
but I touched it as well and held the

1169
00:50:02,059 --> 00:49:59,940
hand so that is an absolutely

1170
00:50:03,890 --> 00:50:02,069
life-changing experience because there's

1171
00:50:07,730 --> 00:50:03,900
absolutely no way that it can be coaxed

1172
00:50:12,380 --> 00:50:07,740
and or faked in the context of the room

1173
00:50:17,390 --> 00:50:12,390
that I was in and how do you explain it

1174
00:50:19,190 --> 00:50:17,400
how does it happen so the the spirits

1175
00:50:22,970 --> 00:50:19,200
who are supposedly speaking through

1176
00:50:25,590 --> 00:50:22,980
Stuart can explain it but

1177
00:50:27,510 --> 00:50:25,600
outside of that context it's very hard

1178
00:50:31,380 --> 00:50:27,520
to explain it if you understand what I'm

1179
00:50:33,600 --> 00:50:31,390
saying yes yeah and I again I encourage

1180
00:50:37,620 --> 00:50:33,610
people to read more I'm going to put on

1181
00:50:40,080 --> 00:50:37,630
my website a wonderful video of a talk

1182
00:50:42,360 --> 00:50:40,090
that Stewart out Center gave I'm gonna

1183
00:50:45,450 --> 00:50:42,370
put it up in the next couple of days he

1184
00:50:47,370 --> 00:50:45,460
gave a talk so it's quite long but it's

1185
00:50:50,250 --> 00:50:47,380
very entertaining he talks about how he

1186
00:50:52,560 --> 00:50:50,260
developed as a medium and what it means

1187
00:50:53,940 --> 00:50:52,570
to him and cetera and some of the events

1188
00:50:54,990 --> 00:50:53,950
he'd been involved with over the course

1189
00:50:58,500 --> 00:50:55,000
of his life and he's absolutely

1190
00:51:01,230 --> 00:50:58,510
wonderful engaging very likeable person

1191
00:51:02,880 --> 00:51:01,240
so I think if people look at that they

1192
00:51:05,250 --> 00:51:02,890
will realize after looking that this guy

1193
00:51:08,430 --> 00:51:05,260
couldn't possibly be a fake you can just

1194
00:51:11,340 --> 00:51:08,440
tell when you when you experience him

1195
00:51:14,280 --> 00:51:11,350
and I actually have tested that the

1196
00:51:16,470 --> 00:51:14,290
reality of all of this so anyway it's

1197
00:51:19,440 --> 00:51:16,480
it's a it's a difficult thing to talk

1198
00:51:21,260 --> 00:51:19,450
about because it's you know it's very

1199
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:21,270
strange hard for people to believe

1200
00:51:27,750 --> 00:51:24,610
understandably so and it's personal for

1201
00:51:30,540 --> 00:51:27,760
me because I was there so this is a very

1202
00:51:33,960 --> 00:51:30,550
different kind of a topic for me than

1203
00:51:37,290 --> 00:51:33,970
UFOs I have to say Tom with Leslie Kane

1204
00:51:40,620 --> 00:51:37,300
our guest co-host is Erica Luke's with

1205
00:51:48,299 --> 00:51:40,630
Jean Erica and Leslie you're in the para

1206
00:51:58,500 --> 00:51:52,230
you are listening to GCN

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visit GCN live.com today attack of the

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1213
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1214
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1215
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1216
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1217
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1256
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1257
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1258
00:54:24,429 --> 00:54:22,819
here's Jane Steinberg okay you win one

1259
00:54:26,709 --> 00:54:24,439
of the power cast awards for that which

1260
00:54:29,140 --> 00:54:26,719
has no value whatever but what happy to

1261
00:54:32,169 --> 00:54:29,150
have you doing now you're telling us

1262
00:54:34,359 --> 00:54:32,179
here in the previous segment and earlier

1263
00:54:36,279 --> 00:54:34,369
in the show how the people you were in

1264
00:54:37,569 --> 00:54:36,289
touch with who impressed you you did

1265
00:54:40,179 --> 00:54:37,579
what you could to do your due diligence

1266
00:54:42,429 --> 00:54:40,189
to make sure they didn't pull a fast one

1267
00:54:44,620 --> 00:54:42,439
on you in the course of writing the book

1268
00:54:46,419 --> 00:54:44,630
that you run into people who did try to

1269
00:54:48,880 --> 00:54:46,429
pull a fast one on you can you tell us

1270
00:54:50,709 --> 00:54:48,890
more I didn't have a lot of time to do

1271
00:54:53,799 --> 00:54:50,719
the book I wish I'd had two or three

1272
00:54:55,419 --> 00:54:53,809
more years but I was very careful you

1273
00:54:58,419 --> 00:54:55,429
know about who I approached ahead of

1274
00:55:00,339 --> 00:54:58,429
time no I haven't personally run into

1275
00:55:02,650 --> 00:55:00,349
that although I know that it happens

1276
00:55:04,630 --> 00:55:02,660
there was this one physical medium for

1277
00:55:06,339 --> 00:55:04,640
instance who was building up a kind of a

1278
00:55:07,749 --> 00:55:06,349
reputation during the time I was writing

1279
00:55:09,819 --> 00:55:07,759
the book and somebody put a hidden

1280
00:55:12,969 --> 00:55:09,829
camera in the room and he was caught

1281
00:55:14,529 --> 00:55:12,979
cheating so these things happen but I

1282
00:55:17,679 --> 00:55:14,539
didn't end up in any situations like

1283
00:55:19,419 --> 00:55:17,689
that myself no so I wanted to ask you

1284
00:55:22,779 --> 00:55:19,429
with regard to the person you were

1285
00:55:24,729 --> 00:55:22,789
talking about Stewart Alexander how did

1286
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:24,739
this affect him physically and

1287
00:55:29,890 --> 00:55:28,130
emotionally prior to the seance and then

1288
00:55:30,999 --> 00:55:29,900
after the seance because it is my

1289
00:55:32,769 --> 00:55:31,009
understanding that this can be

1290
00:55:36,039 --> 00:55:32,779
incredibly physically and emotionally

1291
00:55:38,739 --> 00:55:36,049
draining and demanding for the medium

1292
00:55:40,809 --> 00:55:38,749
yeah it is for him I mean especially now

1293
00:55:43,179 --> 00:55:40,819
you know 70 years old and he's been

1294
00:55:45,729 --> 00:55:43,189
doing this for a long time it is tiring

1295
00:55:48,219 --> 00:55:45,739
but he initially goes into a deep trance

1296
00:55:49,959 --> 00:55:48,229
and that happens very quickly for

1297
00:55:52,630 --> 00:55:49,969
Stewart I mean within a matter of a

1298
00:55:55,660 --> 00:55:52,640
minute or something and sometimes when

1299
00:55:57,969 --> 00:55:55,670
he comes out of it at the end he's tired

1300
00:55:59,919 --> 00:55:57,979
okay the transition can be slow and he's

1301
00:56:01,689 --> 00:55:59,929
tired after it would be very hard for

1302
00:56:03,309 --> 00:56:01,699
him for instance to do it again the next

1303
00:56:05,739 --> 00:56:03,319
day you know that would be very

1304
00:56:08,259 --> 00:56:05,749
difficult so he sits once a week with

1305
00:56:10,120 --> 00:56:08,269
his circle a small circle but he's been

1306
00:56:12,069 --> 00:56:10,130
sitting with for 30 years there's

1307
00:56:14,169 --> 00:56:12,079
something and yeah but it is tiring but

1308
00:56:16,329 --> 00:56:14,179
he's just so used to he's been doing it

1309
00:56:18,030 --> 00:56:16,339
for so long now that I don't think it's

1310
00:56:19,440 --> 00:56:18,040
you know that bad for

1311
00:56:22,050 --> 00:56:19,450
he's even done it before when he's been

1312
00:56:24,660 --> 00:56:22,060
ill and he's been able to do it so he

1313
00:56:27,630 --> 00:56:24,670
just sort of go he just drifts into this

1314
00:56:29,760 --> 00:56:27,640
trance the the people whatever you want

1315
00:56:31,620 --> 00:56:29,770
to call them spirit Stuart hurts him as

1316
00:56:34,290 --> 00:56:31,630
the spirit people that speak through his

1317
00:56:36,780 --> 00:56:34,300
body actually just kind of take over his

1318
00:56:38,490 --> 00:56:36,790
body and he's gone so and that's it's

1319
00:56:41,100 --> 00:56:38,500
it's like being in a deep sleep he's

1320
00:56:43,410 --> 00:56:41,110
completely unconscious so it's tiring

1321
00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:43,420
but it's not debilitating or anything

1322
00:56:45,930 --> 00:56:43,930
for him

1323
00:56:47,760 --> 00:56:45,940
I'm sure you would have to get used to

1324
00:56:50,040 --> 00:56:47,770
that he probably it has a good support

1325
00:56:52,290 --> 00:56:50,050
system around him which is important

1326
00:56:53,850 --> 00:56:52,300
what does he remember anything when he

1327
00:56:55,940 --> 00:56:53,860
goes under in this trance-like state

1328
00:56:57,780 --> 00:56:55,950
does he remember the experience

1329
00:57:00,090 --> 00:56:57,790
absolutely nothing it's like he's

1330
00:57:02,370 --> 00:57:00,100
completely unconscious so when he comes

1331
00:57:04,320 --> 00:57:02,380
in he'll what comes back his first

1332
00:57:06,030 --> 00:57:04,330
question is was it good he's always he's

1333
00:57:08,370 --> 00:57:06,040
so concerned that when he has guests

1334
00:57:11,040 --> 00:57:08,380
there like if I'm there that he doesn't

1335
00:57:13,170 --> 00:57:11,050
disappoint them though his first concern

1336
00:57:14,790 --> 00:57:13,180
is always what happened was it a good

1337
00:57:16,530 --> 00:57:14,800
sitting and then people usually have to

1338
00:57:18,540 --> 00:57:16,540
tell him he has no idea what's going on

1339
00:57:21,180 --> 00:57:18,550
and by the way I just want to let people

1340
00:57:23,160 --> 00:57:21,190
know that Stuart himself actually wrote

1341
00:57:24,870 --> 00:57:23,170
the concluding chapter to my book he

1342
00:57:27,030 --> 00:57:24,880
wrote it himself and he's never done

1343
00:57:29,460 --> 00:57:27,040
this before because he's such a private

1344
00:57:31,350 --> 00:57:29,470
person he has written a memoir but it's

1345
00:57:32,730 --> 00:57:31,360
was published by a small publisher in

1346
00:57:34,980 --> 00:57:32,740
England and not many you know not that

1347
00:57:37,050 --> 00:57:34,990
many people have read it but he wrote

1348
00:57:38,850 --> 00:57:37,060
this very fascinating chapter where he

1349
00:57:40,800 --> 00:57:38,860
does talk about what it's like for him

1350
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:40,810
to be doing what he's doing and how he

1351
00:57:46,410 --> 00:57:43,690
evolved and how long it took for this

1352
00:57:47,940 --> 00:57:46,420
all to evolve with him so I think people

1353
00:57:49,410 --> 00:57:47,950
will find his chapter I think it's

1354
00:57:52,080 --> 00:57:49,420
incredible the people will really enjoy

1355
00:57:54,750 --> 00:57:52,090
reading that sounds incredible is his

1356
00:57:56,520 --> 00:57:54,760
book airs memoir what is that even

1357
00:57:59,370 --> 00:57:56,530
though it's probably out of print I mean

1358
00:58:02,040 --> 00:57:59,380
could somebody go to Amazon and try to

1359
00:58:03,780 --> 00:58:02,050
find copy of that absolutely and I will

1360
00:58:05,910 --> 00:58:03,790
mention that on my website - it's called

1361
00:58:08,190 --> 00:58:05,920
an extraordinary journey and it's on

1362
00:58:09,750 --> 00:58:08,200
Amazon and you can order it and I highly

1363
00:58:12,600 --> 00:58:09,760
recommend it to anybody who's interested

1364
00:58:14,640 --> 00:58:12,610
in physical mediumship or or just in

1365
00:58:16,770 --> 00:58:14,650
Stuart and it's a beautiful book and if

1366
00:58:19,650 --> 00:58:16,780
that's what really turned me on to him

1367
00:58:21,630 --> 00:58:19,660
when I first discovered that book and I

1368
00:58:23,940 --> 00:58:21,640
saw the video that I mentioned about him

1369
00:58:26,550 --> 00:58:23,950
and I thought this is the guy this is

1370
00:58:29,190 --> 00:58:26,560
the guy that I want to meet and sit with

1371
00:58:31,770 --> 00:58:29,200
for my book there's nobody else and it

1372
00:58:33,690 --> 00:58:31,780
was just this instant chemistry

1373
00:58:36,090 --> 00:58:33,700
I felt that he was the right person he

1374
00:58:37,410 --> 00:58:36,100
was the real the real thing and I think

1375
00:58:39,960 --> 00:58:37,420
anybody who reads this book will

1376
00:58:42,120 --> 00:58:39,970
probably agree with that so I recommend

1377
00:58:43,890 --> 00:58:42,130
it I will get a copy that sounds

1378
00:58:47,520 --> 00:58:43,900
wonderful thank you for for mentioning

1379
00:58:48,480 --> 00:58:47,530
that yes yes it's a little bit later our

1380
00:58:50,790 --> 00:58:48,490
listeners have asked a lot of

1381
00:58:53,730 --> 00:58:50,800
interesting questions of Leslie Kane a

1382
00:58:56,700 --> 00:58:53,740
little bit later Erica will fish them up

1383
00:58:59,880 --> 00:58:56,710
and take them out and go from there and

1384
00:59:04,050 --> 00:58:59,890
see where they go now Leslie in terms of

1385
00:59:06,810 --> 00:59:04,060
scientific research of either mediumship

1386
00:59:10,110 --> 00:59:06,820
or possible contact with people who are

1387
00:59:13,320 --> 00:59:10,120
no longer here have scientists reach any

1388
00:59:15,360 --> 00:59:13,330
understanding I would say no I mean

1389
00:59:17,400 --> 00:59:15,370
scientists have explored the phenomena

1390
00:59:19,530 --> 00:59:17,410
which are the fascinating aspects of

1391
00:59:23,250 --> 00:59:19,540
this you know the actual phenomena

1392
00:59:25,710 --> 00:59:23,260
themselves and of course they have their

1393
00:59:29,730 --> 00:59:25,720
own conclusions that they make but they

1394
00:59:32,100 --> 00:59:29,740
can't prove really that any of this has

1395
00:59:34,700 --> 00:59:32,110
anything to do with the afterlife it's

1396
00:59:37,610 --> 00:59:34,710
highly suggestive of that and they may

1397
00:59:42,710 --> 00:59:37,620
make statements along those lines but

1398
00:59:45,600 --> 00:59:42,720
you know obviously we can't prove it so

1399
00:59:48,150 --> 00:59:45,610
the scientific researches is absolutely

1400
00:59:51,600 --> 00:59:48,160
essential and fascinating and compelling

1401
00:59:53,070 --> 00:59:51,610
and reveal very revealing of this of

1402
00:59:54,720 --> 00:59:53,080
lots of different areas that I think

1403
00:59:56,790 --> 00:59:54,730
kind of interconnect with each other

1404
00:59:58,580 --> 00:59:56,800
which is one of the things I was trying

1405
01:00:01,980 --> 00:59:58,590
to do in my book was to show how

1406
01:00:04,110 --> 01:00:01,990
different areas interconnect and support

1407
01:00:06,330 --> 01:00:04,120
other areas of research because in the

1408
01:00:08,550 --> 01:00:06,340
past these areas have tended to be all

1409
01:00:11,070 --> 01:00:08,560
presented separately you know one book

1410
01:00:12,570 --> 01:00:11,080
would be about one specific aspect like

1411
01:00:15,090 --> 01:00:12,580
one person's NDE

1412
01:00:16,560 --> 01:00:15,100
or after death communications or

1413
01:00:19,860 --> 01:00:16,570
whatever but I'm trying to show how they

1414
01:00:25,710 --> 01:00:19,870
all interrelated get what your question

1415
01:00:27,210 --> 01:00:25,720
was gene I'm sorry your question I think

1416
01:00:30,420 --> 01:00:27,220
it was about basically scientific

1417
01:00:31,770 --> 01:00:30,430
research yes who are trying to figure

1418
01:00:35,240 --> 01:00:31,780
out what's going on and whether they

1419
01:00:39,180 --> 01:00:35,250
have any ideas about this phenomenon

1420
01:00:40,920 --> 01:00:39,190
they have a lot of good data and a lot

1421
01:00:43,230 --> 01:00:40,930
of good case studies but whether they

1422
01:00:43,750 --> 01:00:43,240
can actually what their ideas are about

1423
01:00:45,870 --> 01:00:43,760
what it

1424
01:00:48,070 --> 01:00:45,880
is that something completely different

1425
01:00:50,109 --> 01:00:48,080
but again I'm going to post some of

1426
01:00:53,320 --> 01:00:50,119
these great case studies on my website I

1427
01:00:55,720 --> 01:00:53,330
hope people will read them they

1428
01:00:59,170 --> 01:00:55,730
absolutely will and and I you know

1429
01:01:00,970 --> 01:00:59,180
looking through some of your the pieces

1430
01:01:03,430 --> 01:01:00,980
in your book and what you're offering I

1431
01:01:05,560 --> 01:01:03,440
mean there there's you talk about

1432
01:01:10,680 --> 01:01:05,570
different mediums

1433
01:01:14,349 --> 01:01:10,690
throughout history at the Palladino and

1434
01:01:19,510 --> 01:01:14,359
of course you mentioned earlier that in

1435
01:01:21,760 --> 01:01:19,520
in drusen and yeah this is this is

1436
01:01:24,430 --> 01:01:21,770
really fascinating to me are there's

1437
01:01:27,340 --> 01:01:24,440
some other mediums that that stood out

1438
01:01:31,000 --> 01:01:27,350
to you back when this really took root

1439
01:01:33,190 --> 01:01:31,010
that were absolute frauds that kind of

1440
01:01:36,160 --> 01:01:33,200
discredited what the real mediums were

1441
01:01:38,530 --> 01:01:36,170
trying to do I mean there were lots of

1442
01:01:41,620 --> 01:01:38,540
frauds but I didn't spend time studying

1443
01:01:43,390 --> 01:01:41,630
them all because I just don't think

1444
01:01:46,120 --> 01:01:43,400
they're interesting you know I read

1445
01:01:47,590 --> 01:01:46,130
plenty of them but I just wanted to

1446
01:01:49,810 --> 01:01:47,600
mention that you know you mentioned that

1447
01:01:51,580 --> 01:01:49,820
there there have been great mediums

1448
01:01:54,280 --> 01:01:51,590
through history that haven't studied so

1449
01:01:57,310 --> 01:01:54,290
thoroughly such as you say be a

1450
01:01:59,410 --> 01:01:57,320
Palladino who you mentioned the it the

1451
01:02:01,450 --> 01:01:59,420
medium you say Pia Palladino who you

1452
01:02:03,130 --> 01:02:01,460
mentioned Erika from Italy who was you

1453
01:02:04,960 --> 01:02:03,140
know these these three skeptics were

1454
01:02:06,880 --> 01:02:04,970
sent to study her who had every

1455
01:02:08,670 --> 01:02:06,890
intention of proving her to be a fraud

1456
01:02:12,280 --> 01:02:08,680
and these were like the leadings

1457
01:02:14,470 --> 01:02:12,290
debunking skeptical studiers of

1458
01:02:18,670 --> 01:02:14,480
mediumship in the world and they had

1459
01:02:21,250 --> 01:02:18,680
already proven so many to be frauds who

1460
01:02:24,670 --> 01:02:21,260
they had studied so they what the tricks

1461
01:02:26,320 --> 01:02:24,680
work they studied this and they did a

1462
01:02:28,210 --> 01:02:26,330
series of studies on you say beyond a

1463
01:02:29,890 --> 01:02:28,220
very a hundred percent controlled

1464
01:02:31,960 --> 01:02:29,900
environment and they had no choice but

1465
01:02:33,790 --> 01:02:31,970
to acknowledge that she was producing

1466
01:02:36,460 --> 01:02:33,800
phenomena that they couldn't explain and

1467
01:02:39,430 --> 01:02:36,470
so there are situations like that which

1468
01:02:41,410 --> 01:02:39,440
are really scientific proof of the

1469
01:02:44,950 --> 01:02:41,420
reality of the phenomena that these

1470
01:02:46,750 --> 01:02:44,960
mediums can provide now whether they

1471
01:02:49,660 --> 01:02:46,760
have anything to do with dead people or

1472
01:02:51,460 --> 01:02:49,670
not that's the ultimate question right

1473
01:02:54,070 --> 01:02:51,470
the question is hard to answer of course

1474
01:02:55,390 --> 01:02:54,080
the mediums have absolutely no they I

1475
01:02:57,690 --> 01:02:55,400
don't have any question about it and

1476
01:03:00,099 --> 01:02:57,700
you'll read what Stewart Alexander says

1477
01:03:03,130 --> 01:03:00,109
they they can't imagine that it could

1478
01:03:06,099 --> 01:03:03,140
possibly be anything else but the

1479
01:03:09,279 --> 01:03:06,109
outside intellectuals who looking in and

1480
01:03:10,900 --> 01:03:09,289
I have to say that a lot of the skeptics

1481
01:03:12,279 --> 01:03:10,910
have obviously haven't sat with these

1482
01:03:13,859 --> 01:03:12,289
mediums themselves but a lot of the

1483
01:03:16,599 --> 01:03:13,869
people raised that question

1484
01:03:17,829 --> 01:03:16,609
even-steven Browdy who's an investigator

1485
01:03:21,069 --> 01:03:17,839
I should have mentioned earlier who I

1486
01:03:22,529 --> 01:03:21,079
highly respect who I quote throughout

1487
01:03:26,710 --> 01:03:22,539
the book he's absolutely extraordinary

1488
01:03:28,029 --> 01:03:26,720
brilliant thinker on this topic and you

1489
01:03:30,519 --> 01:03:28,039
know he'll raise the question of whether

1490
01:03:33,099 --> 01:03:30,529
these phenomena are just created through

1491
01:03:35,229 --> 01:03:33,109
human capacities I have nothing to do

1492
01:03:35,680 --> 01:03:35,239
with dead people I mean I that's the

1493
01:03:37,569 --> 01:03:35,690
question

1494
01:03:40,359 --> 01:03:37,579
let's break it here and we'll pick it up

1495
01:03:42,880 --> 01:03:40,369
on this we have Leslie Cain and Erica

1496
01:03:46,150 --> 01:03:42,890
Lucas and gene Steinberg chris is on

1497
01:03:56,559 --> 01:03:46,160
special assignment you're in the para

1498
01:04:00,799 --> 01:03:59,029
attack of the rock codes has been

1499
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well-received by critics and readers

1500
01:04:05,569 --> 01:04:02,730
alike it's a thrill a minute story

1501
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you'll never forget a former US military

1502
01:04:10,190 --> 01:04:07,920
intelligence officer is haunted by

1503
01:04:12,799 --> 01:04:10,200
intense dreams about a beautiful woman

1504
01:04:15,559 --> 01:04:12,809
pleading for his help after a terrible

1505
01:04:17,690 --> 01:04:15,569
battle in outer space but the dreams

1506
01:04:19,670 --> 01:04:17,700
turn out to be true and thrust him into

1507
01:04:22,370 --> 01:04:19,680
a telepathic love affair with a woman

1508
01:04:24,710 --> 01:04:22,380
whose faraway planet is intent on

1509
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destroying the earth and now the

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cast dot-com and don't forget to visit

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1609
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course the question is here is this

1610
01:08:27,730 --> 01:08:25,300
phenomena caused by somehow

1611
01:08:30,190 --> 01:08:27,740
communicating with dead people maybe

1612
01:08:33,190 --> 01:08:30,200
some advanced form of mind-reading where

1613
01:08:36,250 --> 01:08:33,200
are the sources here what could it

1614
01:08:39,250 --> 01:08:36,260
possibly be you say the mediums like to

1615
01:08:40,770 --> 01:08:39,260
assume it's contact with the dead but

1616
01:08:43,750 --> 01:08:40,780
isn't that really an article of faith

1617
01:08:47,050 --> 01:08:43,760
well I don't think they feel there's any

1618
01:08:48,520 --> 01:08:47,060
other way to explain it and I think when

1619
01:08:50,320 --> 01:08:48,530
you read what happens with do without

1620
01:08:52,900 --> 01:08:50,330
eggs and ER you would find it very hard

1621
01:08:54,460 --> 01:08:52,910
to explain away also it would take me a

1622
01:08:57,400 --> 01:08:54,470
long time to explain it but when you

1623
01:08:59,860 --> 01:08:57,410
have these independent entities speaking

1624
01:09:02,560 --> 01:08:59,870
through them who have previously lived

1625
01:09:04,450 --> 01:09:02,570
on the earth and who can produce these

1626
01:09:07,330 --> 01:09:04,460
extraordinary phenomena in the seance

1627
01:09:09,610 --> 01:09:07,340
room that Stewart couldn't possibly

1628
01:09:11,650 --> 01:09:09,620
imagine that he could ever do himself

1629
01:09:14,500 --> 01:09:11,660
while he was completely unconscious I

1630
01:09:16,690 --> 01:09:14,510
mean to him it's just inconceivable plus

1631
01:09:19,300 --> 01:09:16,700
the people in the room have gotten to

1632
01:09:22,060 --> 01:09:19,310
know these spirit people so well over

1633
01:09:24,340 --> 01:09:22,070
the years that they just don't doubt

1634
01:09:26,770 --> 01:09:24,350
their reality it just becomes a sort of

1635
01:09:29,500 --> 01:09:26,780
a another world in there and that's how

1636
01:09:30,550 --> 01:09:29,510
they operate there's no proof you know

1637
01:09:34,060 --> 01:09:30,560
everybody has to make up their own

1638
01:09:37,900 --> 01:09:34,070
decision what can you say it's just it's

1639
01:09:40,090 --> 01:09:37,910
it is hard to explain how one human

1640
01:09:43,090 --> 01:09:40,100
being could materialize another human

1641
01:09:45,850 --> 01:09:43,100
being and not have some kind of external

1642
01:09:47,740 --> 01:09:45,860
force being involved with that process

1643
01:09:49,450 --> 01:09:47,750
that's the question is there an external

1644
01:09:52,650 --> 01:09:49,460
force involved or is it all coming

1645
01:09:55,060 --> 01:09:52,660
through the extraordinary psychokinetic

1646
01:09:58,000 --> 01:09:55,070
abilities of the medium to somehow

1647
01:10:01,000 --> 01:09:58,010
create something alive and physical in

1648
01:10:03,010 --> 01:10:01,010
the room who knows which is the

1649
01:10:06,100 --> 01:10:03,020
explanation harder to accept I mean

1650
01:10:08,710 --> 01:10:06,110
they're both hard to accept that's the

1651
01:10:11,470 --> 01:10:08,720
case it doesn't matter what explanation

1652
01:10:14,290 --> 01:10:11,480
is easier to accept it is what the real

1653
01:10:16,750 --> 01:10:14,300
explanation is but that we will probably

1654
01:10:18,420 --> 01:10:16,760
never know absolutely not and I wanted

1655
01:10:20,680 --> 01:10:18,430
to say that you know for the skeptics

1656
01:10:23,740 --> 01:10:20,690
that you were mentioning the skeptics

1657
01:10:25,150 --> 01:10:23,750
that visited Palladino how mind-boggling

1658
01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:25,160
and that must be really hard for

1659
01:10:29,979 --> 01:10:27,530
somebody that has such a skeptical bent

1660
01:10:32,229 --> 01:10:29,989
to actually understand that there is

1661
01:10:34,630 --> 01:10:32,239
something that is very real and when

1662
01:10:37,090 --> 01:10:34,640
people discount some of these these

1663
01:10:39,189 --> 01:10:37,100
current things taking place now most of

1664
01:10:41,140 --> 01:10:39,199
them have not ever put themselves in a

1665
01:10:43,510 --> 01:10:41,150
position where they could experience

1666
01:10:46,209 --> 01:10:43,520
that and yet they're still making their

1667
01:10:48,550 --> 01:10:46,219
broad statements that this is has been

1668
01:10:51,100 --> 01:10:48,560
debunked and I find that quite comical

1669
01:10:53,050 --> 01:10:51,110
in a way you unless you're there like

1670
01:10:54,790 --> 01:10:53,060
you and you could see this with your own

1671
01:10:57,340 --> 01:10:54,800
eyes and understand that there was

1672
01:11:01,689 --> 01:10:57,350
nothing else at work this it's it's just

1673
01:11:04,750 --> 01:11:01,699
interesting and the great investigators

1674
01:11:07,180 --> 01:11:04,760
of the historical investigators such as

1675
01:11:08,740 --> 01:11:07,190
one of the ones who did investigate you

1676
01:11:11,890 --> 01:11:08,750
say the apology you know has written

1677
01:11:14,500 --> 01:11:11,900
that very thing he wants every scientist

1678
01:11:16,330 --> 01:11:14,510
who is interested in this topic they

1679
01:11:18,220 --> 01:11:16,340
absolutely must sit with the mediums

1680
01:11:21,160 --> 01:11:18,230
themselves or there's no way that they

1681
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:21,170
can do a proper investigation and that's

1682
01:11:25,390 --> 01:11:22,570
that's a really important consideration

1683
01:11:27,610 --> 01:11:25,400
and the interesting thing too about when

1684
01:11:29,800 --> 01:11:27,620
these skeptical people did study you say

1685
01:11:32,080 --> 01:11:29,810
Pia Palladino they kept a sort of a

1686
01:11:34,300 --> 01:11:32,090
written daily Rickon written record and

1687
01:11:36,430 --> 01:11:34,310
they described their own personal

1688
01:11:38,650 --> 01:11:36,440
transformation their own reactions to

1689
01:11:41,590 --> 01:11:38,660
what was going on their own desire to

1690
01:11:42,760 --> 01:11:41,600
prove her fraud and their frustration

1691
01:11:45,939 --> 01:11:42,770
with the fact that they couldn't do it

1692
01:11:48,640 --> 01:11:45,949
and so it's fascinating to read for any

1693
01:11:50,740 --> 01:11:48,650
skeptic to read what these three

1694
01:11:52,240 --> 01:11:50,750
individuals wrote in the process they

1695
01:11:54,700 --> 01:11:52,250
went through and they came up against

1696
01:11:56,110 --> 01:11:54,710
this and had no choice but to recognize

1697
01:11:58,630 --> 01:11:56,120
that these phenomena were actually

1698
01:12:00,760 --> 01:11:58,640
occurring they had no choice and that's

1699
01:12:03,160 --> 01:12:00,770
great that they journals that they wrote

1700
01:12:05,170 --> 01:12:03,170
entries about their personal kind of

1701
01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:05,180
transformation from skeptic to

1702
01:12:09,370 --> 01:12:06,530
understanding that there's more to

1703
01:12:11,140 --> 01:12:09,380
reality that's important they published

1704
01:12:13,420 --> 01:12:11,150
a long study on the case and that

1705
01:12:15,189 --> 01:12:13,430
included you know just sort of some of

1706
01:12:17,560 --> 01:12:15,199
their reactions that they came up with

1707
01:12:19,150 --> 01:12:17,570
as they went along so you can you can

1708
01:12:22,000 --> 01:12:19,160
read about it yeah it's fantastic it's

1709
01:12:25,090 --> 01:12:22,010
one of the great works we have in this

1710
01:12:27,250 --> 01:12:25,100
field or that everybody should read well

1711
01:12:30,130 --> 01:12:27,260
it certainly is something that looks to

1712
01:12:32,850 --> 01:12:30,140
me like it's worth exploration by almost

1713
01:12:34,600 --> 01:12:32,860
anybody not just because it's become

1714
01:12:37,960 --> 01:12:34,610
popular culture

1715
01:12:41,050 --> 01:12:37,970
and you see it in movies and on TV shows

1716
01:12:42,220 --> 01:12:41,060
and things like that that real people do

1717
01:12:44,830 --> 01:12:42,230
these things now

1718
01:12:47,170 --> 01:12:44,840
when you look at a medium how does that

1719
01:12:50,590 --> 01:12:47,180
medium compare with someone who calls

1720
01:12:52,870 --> 01:12:50,600
themselves a psychic well that's a good

1721
01:12:55,330 --> 01:12:52,880
question Jean and a psychic would be

1722
01:12:57,490 --> 01:12:55,340
somebody who uses their own psychic

1723
01:13:00,370 --> 01:12:57,500
abilities to sit down with somebody else

1724
01:13:03,010 --> 01:13:00,380
and give them information that they're

1725
01:13:05,290 --> 01:13:03,020
picking up psychically so a psychic

1726
01:13:07,300 --> 01:13:05,300
reading doesn't involve any connection

1727
01:13:09,250 --> 01:13:07,310
to any deceased people on the part of

1728
01:13:11,140 --> 01:13:09,260
the medium and they they're clear about

1729
01:13:12,610 --> 01:13:11,150
that you go to a psychic reading you're

1730
01:13:15,280 --> 01:13:12,620
getting psychic information you might

1731
01:13:16,930 --> 01:13:15,290
get information about your future or

1732
01:13:18,670 --> 01:13:16,940
what you know what your career choices

1733
01:13:21,250 --> 01:13:18,680
should be you might ask questions about

1734
01:13:25,090 --> 01:13:21,260
your marriages things like that but when

1735
01:13:27,460 --> 01:13:25,100
you go to a mediumship reading as

1736
01:13:29,740 --> 01:13:27,470
opposed to a psychic reading you are

1737
01:13:31,690 --> 01:13:29,750
connecting with a deceased person that

1738
01:13:33,490 --> 01:13:31,700
you've lost if the meeting is successful

1739
01:13:35,320 --> 01:13:33,500
if the medium is successful the reading

1740
01:13:37,510 --> 01:13:35,330
is successful and that's the difference

1741
01:13:40,420 --> 01:13:37,520
that in that case the medium is bringing

1742
01:13:42,970 --> 01:13:40,430
in the energy of a deceased person that

1743
01:13:44,800 --> 01:13:42,980
is connected to the sitter and you're

1744
01:13:46,680 --> 01:13:44,810
hoping to connect with that person and

1745
01:13:49,270 --> 01:13:46,690
you're hoping to get enough information

1746
01:13:51,490 --> 01:13:49,280
that you are you become convinced that

1747
01:13:52,420 --> 01:13:51,500
that person is actually the person that

1748
01:13:54,580 --> 01:13:52,430
they claimed to be

1749
01:13:56,770 --> 01:13:54,590
that is your deceased friend or family

1750
01:13:58,480 --> 01:13:56,780
member and the only way you can be

1751
01:14:01,510 --> 01:13:58,490
convinced about is to be given a lot of

1752
01:14:03,640 --> 01:14:01,520
accurate information so that the person

1753
01:14:06,010 --> 01:14:03,650
identifies themselves to you that's the

1754
01:14:08,080 --> 01:14:06,020
process of what goes on in a medium ship

1755
01:14:10,330 --> 01:14:08,090
reading and you there isn't necessarily

1756
01:14:14,500 --> 01:14:10,340
a lot of messaging that comes through

1757
01:14:16,420 --> 01:14:14,510
it's more just wanting to be convinced

1758
01:14:20,140 --> 01:14:16,430
that that person has survived death

1759
01:14:22,420 --> 01:14:20,150
that's the point of it well the other

1760
01:14:25,030 --> 01:14:22,430
interesting thing here is if they're

1761
01:14:26,680 --> 01:14:25,040
communicating with dead people I keep

1762
01:14:30,430 --> 01:14:26,690
thinking of the lion in the movie of The

1763
01:14:33,340 --> 01:14:30,440
Sixth Sense the movie of course had that

1764
01:14:35,640 --> 01:14:33,350
famous line I see dead people and he was

1765
01:14:38,230 --> 01:14:35,650
seeing literally people who had died

1766
01:14:41,200 --> 01:14:38,240
including the Bruce Willis character

1767
01:14:45,100 --> 01:14:41,210
which is the big spoiler of the film in

1768
01:14:47,230 --> 01:14:45,110
any case here therefore we get to assume

1769
01:14:48,160 --> 01:14:47,240
the the medium is communicating with

1770
01:14:51,270 --> 01:14:48,170
people who are died

1771
01:14:54,220 --> 01:14:51,280
people who are dead have the ability to

1772
01:14:56,050 --> 01:14:54,230
somehow communicate with a living

1773
01:14:58,410 --> 01:14:56,060
isn't that the really the core of it

1774
01:15:00,880 --> 01:14:58,420
right there whether that's possible

1775
01:15:03,610 --> 01:15:00,890
very important point gene I mean

1776
01:15:05,560 --> 01:15:03,620
absolutely critical and I I do make I

1777
01:15:07,270 --> 01:15:05,570
address this very issue in my

1778
01:15:08,919 --> 01:15:07,280
introduction to my book and everybody

1779
01:15:11,709 --> 01:15:08,929
has to be aware of it that if we are

1780
01:15:13,990 --> 01:15:11,719
going to accept what we call the

1781
01:15:15,640 --> 01:15:14,000
survival the evidence for survival if we

1782
01:15:18,790 --> 01:15:15,650
are going to look at the data that we

1783
01:15:21,669 --> 01:15:18,800
have and interpret it as being evidence

1784
01:15:23,229 --> 01:15:21,679
for the survival of consciousness there

1785
01:15:27,160 --> 01:15:23,239
are certain assumptions that we are

1786
01:15:28,990 --> 01:15:27,170
making about the nature of that reality

1787
01:15:31,209 --> 01:15:29,000
and one of them is just what you said

1788
01:15:34,090 --> 01:15:31,219
we're making the assumption that dead

1789
01:15:37,450 --> 01:15:34,100
people want to communicate with us that

1790
01:15:39,939 --> 01:15:37,460
they can communicate with us that they

1791
01:15:42,490 --> 01:15:39,949
can find somebody called a medium

1792
01:15:44,950 --> 01:15:42,500
through which to communicate with us all

1793
01:15:48,160 --> 01:15:44,960
these things have to be part of the

1794
01:15:50,770 --> 01:15:48,170
scenario that we are allowing to be real

1795
01:15:53,979 --> 01:15:50,780
in order to be able to interpret it this

1796
01:15:56,229 --> 01:15:53,989
way if you if you get my points so it's

1797
01:15:58,300 --> 01:15:56,239
a very astute insight that you've had

1798
01:16:00,610 --> 01:15:58,310
and I think most people who want very

1799
01:16:03,040 --> 01:16:00,620
much to believe in survival past death

1800
01:16:05,110 --> 01:16:03,050
are not willing to acknowledge that we

1801
01:16:07,479 --> 01:16:05,120
are making certain assumptions about it

1802
01:16:09,459 --> 01:16:07,489
that may not that we have to believe in

1803
01:16:12,160 --> 01:16:09,469
in order to interpret the data in that

1804
01:16:14,380 --> 01:16:12,170
way otherwise we could as we could say

1805
01:16:16,510 --> 01:16:14,390
it could mean anything and how do we

1806
01:16:19,660 --> 01:16:16,520
know what the afterlife is like how do

1807
01:16:21,610 --> 01:16:19,670
we know that anybody who has died

1808
01:16:23,850 --> 01:16:21,620
would would want to communicate with us

1809
01:16:26,260 --> 01:16:23,860
or could communicate with us we don't

1810
01:16:27,970 --> 01:16:26,270
know I guess suppose one other wacky

1811
01:16:30,640 --> 01:16:27,980
theory which our voice in our next

1812
01:16:33,520 --> 01:16:30,650
segment is about a possible universal

1813
01:16:35,919 --> 01:16:33,530
consciousness we have Leslie Kane Erica

1814
01:16:48,919 --> 01:16:35,929
Lucas and Jean Steinberg you're in the

1815
01:16:57,500 --> 01:16:52,820
thank you for listening to GCN

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be sure to visit GCN live.com today mass

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1871
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1872
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business but the tax defense group could

1883
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1884
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1885
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to pennies on the dollar you've got to

1886
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love that so don't just take my word for

1887
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it call them find out for yourself they

1888
01:19:44,670 --> 01:19:42,040
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1889
01:19:46,800 --> 01:19:44,680
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1890
01:19:48,990 --> 01:19:46,810
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1891
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1892
01:19:53,970 --> 01:19:51,130
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1893
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1894
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1895
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1896
01:20:01,920 --> 01:20:00,400
washing your hands with harsh chemicals

1897
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are you happy doing laundry with

1898
01:20:06,150 --> 01:20:03,910
detergents are you happy paying high

1899
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1900
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1901
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1902
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1903
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1904
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items individually and still save big

1905
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you're getting soap products twice as

1906
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good as what you're using now earth

1907
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1908
01:20:28,530 --> 01:20:25,330
deserves the best

1909
01:20:30,480 --> 01:20:28,540
happiness is five-star soap calm why not

1910
01:20:33,240 --> 01:20:30,490
put your money up the drain for a change

1911
01:20:35,640 --> 01:20:33,250
see them at five-star soap calm we're

1912
01:20:38,010 --> 01:20:35,650
call 1-800 three four zero seven zero

1913
01:20:39,660 --> 01:20:38,020
nine one for a catalog Cal Ben's soap

1914
01:20:41,760 --> 01:20:39,670
company can save you thousands of

1915
01:20:44,280 --> 01:20:41,770
dollars and give you good old-fashioned

1916
01:20:46,320 --> 01:20:44,290
real soaps that are triple concentrated

1917
01:20:48,540 --> 01:20:46,330
soaps made from vegetable and coconut

1918
01:20:51,630 --> 01:20:48,550
oils see their full selection of soaps

1919
01:20:54,240 --> 01:20:51,640
at five star soap calm that's f IV e

1920
01:20:56,520 --> 01:20:54,250
star soap calm or call one eight hundred

1921
01:21:04,160 --> 01:20:56,530
three four zero seven zero nine one four

1922
01:21:09,810 --> 01:21:06,930
hi it's grant Cameron from presidential

1923
01:21:12,720 --> 01:21:09,820
UFO calm you're listening to the para

1924
01:21:21,870 --> 01:21:12,730
cast the gold standard of paranormal

1925
01:21:22,350 --> 01:21:21,880
radio so Leslie Kane author of surviving

1926
01:21:24,030 --> 01:21:22,360
death

1927
01:21:26,820 --> 01:21:24,040
you see I'm mentioning that book lots of

1928
01:21:28,800 --> 01:21:26,830
times so people won't forget Leslie

1929
01:21:30,330 --> 01:21:28,810
about a universal consciousness what

1930
01:21:33,510 --> 01:21:30,340
about the other theory that maybe when

1931
01:21:36,720 --> 01:21:33,520
you die you are no longer an individual

1932
01:21:38,190 --> 01:21:36,730
but if someone seeks contact whatever

1933
01:21:41,940 --> 01:21:38,200
element of the universal consciousness

1934
01:21:45,720 --> 01:21:41,950
has what used to be you is able to

1935
01:21:47,600 --> 01:21:45,730
sometimes to respond yeah I mean that to

1936
01:21:50,430 --> 01:21:47,610
me seems like a completely valid

1937
01:21:53,250 --> 01:21:50,440
possibility I mean I'm no expert on

1938
01:21:55,770 --> 01:21:53,260
interpreting this stuff your expertise

1939
01:21:57,750 --> 01:21:55,780
is just as good as mine so what people

1940
01:21:59,880 --> 01:21:57,760
of course are most interested in is that

1941
01:22:02,370 --> 01:21:59,890
personal survival if we all just become

1942
01:22:03,990 --> 01:22:02,380
universal consciousness the question is

1943
01:22:06,630 --> 01:22:04,000
that and how would we be able to be

1944
01:22:08,310 --> 01:22:06,640
accessed through a medium but you're

1945
01:22:10,080 --> 01:22:08,320
suggesting that maybe the part of us

1946
01:22:11,880 --> 01:22:10,090
that does survive can somehow be

1947
01:22:15,870 --> 01:22:11,890
accessed that to me seems like a

1948
01:22:17,900 --> 01:22:15,880
perfectly valid hypothesis I know also

1949
01:22:21,390 --> 01:22:17,910
if the person who is dead even knows

1950
01:22:22,920 --> 01:22:21,400
they're dancin those are good questions

1951
01:22:24,300 --> 01:22:22,930
there's so many interesting things to

1952
01:22:26,190 --> 01:22:24,310
contemplate with us that we don't have

1953
01:22:28,710 --> 01:22:26,200
answers for that's another really great

1954
01:22:30,630 --> 01:22:28,720
question I'm just learning here I'm a

1955
01:22:32,310 --> 01:22:30,640
journalist I've taken a lot of data I

1956
01:22:34,290 --> 01:22:32,320
had some experiences I put it into a

1957
01:22:36,540 --> 01:22:34,300
book and I think I really just still

1958
01:22:39,900 --> 01:22:36,550
some what the best kind of evidential

1959
01:22:43,460 --> 01:22:39,910
material is but I know I have there's a

1960
01:22:46,320 --> 01:22:43,470
lot of things that I'm still learning so

1961
01:22:48,290 --> 01:22:46,330
Erika could you dig up the questions

1962
01:22:51,870 --> 01:22:48,300
from the forum in the question Bank

1963
01:22:55,170 --> 01:22:51,880
maybe bring them out is it possible here

1964
01:22:57,600 --> 01:22:55,180
that children are more sensitive to such

1965
01:22:59,730 --> 01:22:57,610
things and maybe the sensitivity is kind

1966
01:23:02,400 --> 01:22:59,740
of drilled out of them as they go to

1967
01:23:06,420 --> 01:23:02,410
school and they are brainwashed as it

1968
01:23:08,310 --> 01:23:06,430
were well certainly I in my book I've

1969
01:23:10,590 --> 01:23:08,320
studied cases of young children that

1970
01:23:12,010 --> 01:23:10,600
seem that are connected with past lives

1971
01:23:14,890 --> 01:23:12,020
in that sense

1972
01:23:16,510 --> 01:23:14,900
I would say yes I it's possible maybe

1973
01:23:18,370 --> 01:23:16,520
they're more open in other ways too I

1974
01:23:21,210 --> 01:23:18,380
mean we know that children have an

1975
01:23:23,950 --> 01:23:21,220
openness that does tend to go away so

1976
01:23:25,600 --> 01:23:23,960
you may even you know you may have had

1977
01:23:27,580 --> 01:23:25,610
more experience of that than I have Jean

1978
01:23:30,670 --> 01:23:27,590
I in my book I'm particularly interested

1979
01:23:34,000 --> 01:23:30,680
with the the studies on young children

1980
01:23:37,960 --> 01:23:34,010
who remember accurate details about past

1981
01:23:40,780 --> 01:23:37,970
lives and then the they are shown to be

1982
01:23:43,180 --> 01:23:40,790
accurate after the fact and I bring

1983
01:23:45,790 --> 01:23:43,190
forth two cases in my book that are

1984
01:23:48,420 --> 01:23:45,800
wonderful American cases one of them

1985
01:23:50,650 --> 01:23:48,430
involves a two year old boy so young

1986
01:23:53,230 --> 01:23:50,660
providing all this information that he

1987
01:23:55,060 --> 01:23:53,240
couldn't possibly have known and kind of

1988
01:23:59,230 --> 01:23:55,070
reliving the experiences of another life

1989
01:24:01,600 --> 01:23:59,240
so I feel that of all the past life

1990
01:24:03,520 --> 01:24:01,610
memory cases and that whole field was

1991
01:24:05,320 --> 01:24:03,530
huge there been so many studies done on

1992
01:24:07,930 --> 01:24:05,330
reincarnation I think the ones that are

1993
01:24:10,210 --> 01:24:07,940
most evidential are the ones involving

1994
01:24:13,810 --> 01:24:10,220
young children and the ones that can be

1995
01:24:16,270 --> 01:24:13,820
verified as accurate which isn't always

1996
01:24:19,210 --> 01:24:16,280
possible but in those where it is

1997
01:24:21,880 --> 01:24:19,220
possible it's quite amazing well if

1998
01:24:24,250 --> 01:24:21,890
someone's two years old what and how do

1999
01:24:28,060 --> 01:24:24,260
they convey the possibility they're

2000
01:24:30,610 --> 01:24:28,070
sensing something beyond our life well

2001
01:24:32,470 --> 01:24:30,620
in the one case that we could use as an

2002
01:24:34,240 --> 01:24:32,480
example is the case of James Leininger

2003
01:24:37,420 --> 01:24:34,250
and some people may already be familiar

2004
01:24:39,610 --> 01:24:37,430
with this case he was two years old

2005
01:24:42,550 --> 01:24:39,620
and one of the first things he said when

2006
01:24:44,590 --> 01:24:42,560
he learned how to talk here's an example

2007
01:24:47,230 --> 01:24:44,600
he was his mother was pushing him in a

2008
01:24:50,440 --> 01:24:47,240
stroller by a toy shop and they picked

2009
01:24:53,530 --> 01:24:50,450
she picked up a plastic airplane from a

2010
01:24:56,200 --> 01:24:53,540
bin outside and she said to James the

2011
01:24:58,570 --> 01:24:56,210
little boy he wasn't even two yet she

2012
01:25:00,850 --> 01:24:58,580
said look James it has a bomb under it

2013
01:25:03,160 --> 01:25:00,860
and he looked at the thing and he said

2014
01:25:06,370 --> 01:25:03,170
to his mom that's not a bomb it's a

2015
01:25:09,280 --> 01:25:06,380
droite tank he couldn't say his arse

2016
01:25:13,360 --> 01:25:09,290
quite right so his mother went home and

2017
01:25:15,640 --> 01:25:13,370
asked dad what's a drop tank and his dad

2018
01:25:16,750 --> 01:25:15,650
said well it's it's you know it's a it's

2019
01:25:17,980 --> 01:25:16,760
something that it's put under an

2020
01:25:19,750 --> 01:25:17,990
airplane when they're traveling long

2021
01:25:21,580 --> 01:25:19,760
distances to store fuel or ever I mean

2022
01:25:23,590 --> 01:25:21,590
he knew what it was but they could not

2023
01:25:24,010 --> 01:25:23,600
fathom how this two-year-old child knew

2024
01:25:25,330 --> 01:25:24,020
what a dry

2025
01:25:28,720 --> 01:25:25,340
tank was or knew that it was something

2026
01:25:30,310 --> 01:25:28,730
under an airplane and that was mild that

2027
01:25:31,390 --> 01:25:30,320
was the very first thing but James came

2028
01:25:33,760 --> 01:25:31,400
up with a lot of very specific

2029
01:25:37,060 --> 01:25:33,770
information so even though he was barely

2030
01:25:39,580 --> 01:25:37,070
talking he would come out with very very

2031
01:25:42,430 --> 01:25:39,590
specific things like the name of an

2032
01:25:45,250 --> 01:25:42,440
aircraft carrier called the Natoma was

2033
01:25:47,770 --> 01:25:45,260
actually called the Natoma bay but for a

2034
01:25:49,120 --> 01:25:47,780
two-year-old to come up with that when

2035
01:25:52,300 --> 01:25:49,130
he'd never been exposed to anything

2036
01:25:54,370 --> 01:25:52,310
about the de Toma baby for you is it it

2037
01:25:55,660 --> 01:25:54,380
just freaked out his parents I mean they

2038
01:25:57,790 --> 01:25:55,670
didn't know where this information was

2039
01:26:00,400 --> 01:25:57,800
coming from and then he had terrible

2040
01:26:02,170 --> 01:26:00,410
nightmares reliving the death from his

2041
01:26:05,260 --> 01:26:02,180
previous life and eventually was able to

2042
01:26:07,990 --> 01:26:05,270
talk about that and provide names and

2043
01:26:10,210 --> 01:26:08,000
places and enough hardcore information

2044
01:26:13,720 --> 01:26:10,220
that eventually they were able to figure

2045
01:26:15,940 --> 01:26:13,730
out who the person was that James was

2046
01:26:17,680 --> 01:26:15,950
referring to and to check everything out

2047
01:26:19,660 --> 01:26:17,690
and find out that he had been accurate

2048
01:26:22,270 --> 01:26:19,670
with everything that he said it was a

2049
01:26:24,460 --> 01:26:22,280
long process and his dad was the main

2050
01:26:26,320 --> 01:26:24,470
investigator kept careful records of

2051
01:26:29,020 --> 01:26:26,330
everything and was determined to prove

2052
01:26:30,550 --> 01:26:29,030
his child was not telling the truth

2053
01:26:33,420 --> 01:26:30,560
because or that his trial was not

2054
01:26:35,440 --> 01:26:33,430
remembering a past life because it was a

2055
01:26:37,600 --> 01:26:35,450
terrible challenge to his dad's

2056
01:26:41,440 --> 01:26:37,610
Christian faith he could not accept this

2057
01:26:43,420 --> 01:26:41,450
as being real and part of what I had him

2058
01:26:45,190 --> 01:26:43,430
do in my book is right for me some

2059
01:26:47,710 --> 01:26:45,200
excerpts for the chapter or tell the

2060
01:26:49,560 --> 01:26:47,720
story of his son's brief incarnation

2061
01:26:51,640 --> 01:26:49,570
memories in which he details his own

2062
01:26:53,500 --> 01:26:51,650
struggle his spiritual struggle in

2063
01:26:57,390 --> 01:26:53,510
dealing with this and how he eventually

2064
01:27:00,010 --> 01:26:57,400
came through at the end with a positive

2065
01:27:02,140 --> 01:27:00,020
connection to the whole thing but anyway

2066
01:27:03,930 --> 01:27:02,150
that's it that's it in a nutshell take a

2067
01:27:06,370 --> 01:27:03,940
long time to give all the details but

2068
01:27:08,770 --> 01:27:06,380
that's a kind of case it's very hard to

2069
01:27:11,590 --> 01:27:08,780
explain away let's put it that way

2070
01:27:13,000 --> 01:27:11,600
and there are an interesting thing about

2071
01:27:16,330 --> 01:27:13,010
reincarnation there are some very

2072
01:27:17,470 --> 01:27:16,340
profound cases and especially you know

2073
01:27:21,160 --> 01:27:17,480
what do you have these small children

2074
01:27:22,990 --> 01:27:21,170
that live and they're not exposed to the

2075
01:27:26,980 --> 01:27:23,000
media they're not exposed to them and

2076
01:27:31,180 --> 01:27:26,990
they live in very rural places and they

2077
01:27:33,580 --> 01:27:31,190
have either scars or significant like

2078
01:27:36,330 --> 01:27:33,590
night terrors nightmares they're

2079
01:27:38,220 --> 01:27:36,340
recalling these names and then you find

2080
01:27:41,189 --> 01:27:38,230
that a couple towns away there was

2081
01:27:43,260 --> 01:27:41,199
somebody that was murdered and scar that

2082
01:27:45,479 --> 01:27:43,270
the injury took place in the same place

2083
01:27:46,850 --> 01:27:45,489
where the small child has the scar and I

2084
01:27:49,370 --> 01:27:46,860
mean so there's some really interesting

2085
01:27:52,830 --> 01:27:49,380
correlations here that are hard to

2086
01:27:56,010 --> 01:27:52,840
dismiss and the trauma that these young

2087
01:27:57,959 --> 01:27:56,020
children are a reliving due to the past

2088
01:28:00,870 --> 01:27:57,969
life is very intriguing as well and it

2089
01:28:03,330 --> 01:28:00,880
almost seems to once they find closure

2090
01:28:05,790 --> 01:28:03,340
and find out really what is happening

2091
01:28:09,000 --> 01:28:05,800
and identify with this other person they

2092
01:28:11,399 --> 01:28:09,010
can really put put that to bed and move

2093
01:28:13,500 --> 01:28:11,409
on with their lives that's right I mean

2094
01:28:15,030 --> 01:28:13,510
often the children the the they when

2095
01:28:18,000 --> 01:28:15,040
they do have enough information to

2096
01:28:20,220 --> 01:28:18,010
discover the location say of where they

2097
01:28:21,959 --> 01:28:20,230
lived before or they the parents will

2098
01:28:23,879 --> 01:28:21,969
often and the investigators they might

2099
01:28:26,220 --> 01:28:23,889
take the child back to the location

2100
01:28:28,560 --> 01:28:26,230
where they lived before or the child

2101
01:28:30,419 --> 01:28:28,570
will meet members of that previous

2102
01:28:33,270 --> 01:28:30,429
family which is what happened in James's

2103
01:28:35,550 --> 01:28:33,280
case and so those kinds of events as you

2104
01:28:39,060 --> 01:28:35,560
say Erika provide a sort of a resolution

2105
01:28:40,979 --> 01:28:39,070
for them and they do move on and usually

2106
01:28:42,930 --> 01:28:40,989
by the time they're 6 or 7 they've

2107
01:28:44,820 --> 01:28:42,940
completely forgotten all the memories

2108
01:28:45,950 --> 01:28:44,830
that they had and they just go on and

2109
01:28:48,120 --> 01:28:45,960
live in the present

2110
01:28:49,649 --> 01:28:48,130
fortunately be very difficult if that

2111
01:28:52,290 --> 01:28:49,659
didn't happen but there is a sort of

2112
01:28:55,080 --> 01:28:52,300
resolution that comes from connecting

2113
01:28:57,810 --> 01:28:55,090
with the actual place or people from

2114
01:28:59,939 --> 01:28:57,820
that previous life absolutely it's

2115
01:29:02,760 --> 01:28:59,949
fascinating and there's a question in in

2116
01:29:05,520 --> 01:29:02,770
the chatroom just about what do you how

2117
01:29:08,100 --> 01:29:05,530
do you feel what role if any does past

2118
01:29:13,350 --> 01:29:08,110
life regression therapy using hypnosis

2119
01:29:16,020 --> 01:29:13,360
play so a question from Chris Johnson

2120
01:29:18,870 --> 01:29:16,030
here he wants to ask you specifically

2121
01:29:22,979 --> 01:29:18,880
about past life regression therapy using

2122
01:29:24,330 --> 01:29:22,989
hypnosis yeah I mean I know a lot of

2123
01:29:26,479 --> 01:29:24,340
people do that and it's very meaningful

2124
01:29:29,459 --> 01:29:26,489
and sometimes I'm sure they get

2125
01:29:31,260 --> 01:29:29,469
information that can be verified I

2126
01:29:34,410 --> 01:29:31,270
didn't cover it in my book just because

2127
01:29:36,149 --> 01:29:34,420
I had such limited space in the book

2128
01:29:38,879 --> 01:29:36,159
there was so much more I wanted to cover

2129
01:29:40,890 --> 01:29:38,889
than I could and since I think that the

2130
01:29:43,169 --> 01:29:40,900
child cases are the most sort of

2131
01:29:45,479 --> 01:29:43,179
scientifically evidential of all the

2132
01:29:49,649 --> 01:29:45,489
material we have on reincarnation I

2133
01:29:51,780 --> 01:29:49,659
focus exclusively on those cases

2134
01:29:55,020 --> 01:29:51,790
because they're just the evidential

2135
01:29:57,540 --> 01:29:55,030
aspect of them is so strong and I don't

2136
01:29:59,490 --> 01:29:57,550
think it's quite as strong for when you

2137
01:30:00,959 --> 01:29:59,500
involve you know hypnosis with people

2138
01:30:04,140 --> 01:30:00,969
and their adults it's just a different

2139
01:30:08,040 --> 01:30:04,150
kind of a thing so but but you know I

2140
01:30:10,200 --> 01:30:08,050
it's fascinating what can I say you know

2141
01:30:13,560 --> 01:30:10,210
I'm sure it has a big impact on people

2142
01:30:15,320 --> 01:30:13,570
to do that absolutely he also mentions

2143
01:30:18,209 --> 01:30:15,330
Chris mentions many lives many masters

2144
01:30:20,160 --> 01:30:18,219
and I remember reading that book Oh what

2145
01:30:22,680 --> 01:30:20,170
10 15 years ago I'm sure that you're

2146
01:30:24,510 --> 01:30:22,690
familiar with that as well yeah I did

2147
01:30:25,860 --> 01:30:24,520
read that book a long time ago also and

2148
01:30:28,709 --> 01:30:25,870
maybe it that's when it first came out I

2149
01:30:31,350 --> 01:30:28,719
don't remember the first came out but I

2150
01:30:34,220 --> 01:30:31,360
did read it more to come with listener

2151
01:30:48,880 --> 01:30:34,230
questions Leslie Cain and Erica Luke's

2152
01:30:56,729 --> 01:30:52,810
thank you for listening to GCN

2153
01:30:59,260 --> 01:30:56,739
be sure to visit GCN live.com today

2154
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2171
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2173
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2180
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Berkey calm or call 877 eight eight six

2181
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2182
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eight eight six three six five three go

2183
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Berkey calm feet military spokesperson

2184
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adam Pulaski of the collective offer

2185
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2186
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2187
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2188
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2189
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2190
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available no state attentions our well

2191
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tell you sirs if you are a loved one

2192
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took Xarelto and suffered a serious

2193
01:32:41,290 --> 01:32:40,130
bleeding event you may be entitled to

2194
01:32:43,149 --> 01:32:41,300
financial compensation

2195
01:32:44,709 --> 01:32:43,159
Xarelto is a popular prescription blood

2196
01:32:46,149 --> 01:32:44,719
thinner used to prevent blood clots and

2197
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protect patients from strokes the

2198
01:32:49,120 --> 01:32:47,480
serious bleeding events have led to

2199
01:32:51,160 --> 01:32:49,130
numerous cases of hospitalization and

2200
01:32:53,500 --> 01:32:51,170
even death phone lines are open 24/7

2201
01:32:55,839 --> 01:32:53,510
call 802 six one zero nine three seven

2202
01:33:01,080 --> 01:32:55,849
that's 800 two six one zero nine three

2203
01:33:03,660 --> 01:33:01,090
seven you may own a knife

2204
01:33:06,149 --> 01:33:03,670
it's not an indie hammered knife it's

2205
01:33:08,729 --> 01:33:06,159
not a knife from the forge to the

2206
01:33:11,430 --> 01:33:08,739
grinder to the sheath each Indian word

2207
01:33:14,490 --> 01:33:11,440
knife is handcrafted using god-given

2208
01:33:16,970 --> 01:33:14,500
talent the result is the sharpest edge a

2209
01:33:19,800 --> 01:33:16,980
knife can have and a true work of art

2210
01:33:23,520 --> 01:33:19,810
see a variety of knives and the complete

2211
01:33:26,879 --> 01:33:23,530
knife kit at IH knives com indeed

2212
01:33:30,959 --> 01:33:26,889
hammered knives custom knives made in

2213
01:33:32,879 --> 01:33:30,969
America hi there dick Allgaier here I

2214
01:33:35,270 --> 01:33:32,889
was a mainstream television news

2215
01:33:38,100 --> 01:33:35,280
reporter for over three decades I

2216
01:33:40,410 --> 01:33:38,110
normally never do commercial

2217
01:33:42,629 --> 01:33:40,420
endorsements I am very skeptical of

2218
01:33:44,430 --> 01:33:42,639
health supplements but a friend of mine

2219
01:33:47,550 --> 01:33:44,440
told me about his experience with

2220
01:33:49,439 --> 01:33:47,560
synergy 1 so I purchased a bottle and my

2221
01:33:52,320 --> 01:33:49,449
wife and I have been using it for a few

2222
01:33:54,419 --> 01:33:52,330
weeks now I very much dislike so-called

2223
01:33:56,700 --> 01:33:54,429
energy boosters those little energy

2224
01:33:58,500 --> 01:33:56,710
drinks that have caffeine and guarana

2225
01:34:01,410 --> 01:33:58,510
and other things that make your heart

2226
01:34:04,260 --> 01:34:01,420
race this is not that my experience with

2227
01:34:06,780 --> 01:34:04,270
synergy 1 has been great my mood is

2228
01:34:09,689 --> 01:34:06,790
better my joints feel better I have more

2229
01:34:12,359 --> 01:34:09,699
vigor more stamina weigh increased

2230
01:34:15,419 --> 01:34:12,369
productivity my wife and I both noticed

2231
01:34:17,609 --> 01:34:15,429
that we even dream more so I recommend

2232
01:34:21,870 --> 01:34:17,619
synergy 1 it's really good stuff I'm

2233
01:34:25,560 --> 01:34:21,880
having great results with it 8 9 8 8 3 3

2234
01:34:29,040 --> 01:34:25,570
to 5 or visit one world wacom that's one

2235
01:34:30,390 --> 01:34:29,050
world whe wide calm in these uncertain

2236
01:34:32,160 --> 01:34:30,400
times it makes sense to have a

2237
01:34:33,870 --> 01:34:32,170
sustainable backup method to cook food

2238
01:34:35,970 --> 01:34:33,880
and boil water if your current plan

2239
01:34:37,890 --> 01:34:35,980
includes using a fuel burning stove or

2240
01:34:39,899 --> 01:34:37,900
cooking over an open fire then there's a

2241
01:34:42,000 --> 01:34:39,909
much better way the Minuteman rocket

2242
01:34:44,070 --> 01:34:42,010
stove is a biomass burning cooking stove

2243
01:34:45,930 --> 01:34:44,080
that only requires small quantities of

2244
01:34:48,149 --> 01:34:45,940
sticks and twigs for fuel the Minuteman

2245
01:34:50,160 --> 01:34:48,159
stove is easy to use smokeless portable

2246
01:34:51,930 --> 01:34:50,170
powerful and sustainable for the finest

2247
01:34:54,209 --> 01:34:51,940
and survival cooking stoves and fire

2248
01:34:56,520 --> 01:34:54,219
starters made right here in the USA go

2249
01:35:02,350 --> 01:34:56,530
to Minuteman stove comm that's Minuteman

2250
01:35:07,390 --> 01:35:05,350
this is the wrong flag author of the UFO

2251
01:35:19,610 --> 01:35:07,400
encyclopedia other books when you're

2252
01:35:25,770 --> 01:35:22,380
we continue with guest co-host Erica

2253
01:35:28,320 --> 01:35:25,780
Luke's unless the cane is our guest for

2254
01:35:30,750 --> 01:35:28,330
this week and we're talking about the

2255
01:35:32,420 --> 01:35:30,760
possibility of life after death and now

2256
01:35:34,740 --> 01:35:32,430
we've been focusing a bit on

2257
01:35:37,680 --> 01:35:34,750
reincarnation I guess the theory has it

2258
01:35:42,210 --> 01:35:37,690
here that when you die you are reborn in

2259
01:35:45,330 --> 01:35:42,220
another body and that sometimes the

2260
01:35:48,570 --> 01:35:45,340
person in this new body retains some

2261
01:35:50,190 --> 01:35:48,580
memories of the old life but then the

2262
01:35:51,660 --> 01:35:50,200
thing I always wondered about that it

2263
01:35:55,590 --> 01:35:51,670
has nothing to do with whether this is

2264
01:35:59,340 --> 01:35:55,600
true or not is if you're being judged

2265
01:36:01,890 --> 01:35:59,350
whether to return to Earth based on your

2266
01:36:03,810 --> 01:36:01,900
behavior in a previous life if you don't

2267
01:36:06,900 --> 01:36:03,820
remember that life how do you avoid

2268
01:36:09,660 --> 01:36:06,910
repeating the same mistakes it's all

2269
01:36:11,550 --> 01:36:09,670
complete speculation and my

2270
01:36:13,350 --> 01:36:11,560
interpretation would be and again it's

2271
01:36:15,120 --> 01:36:13,360
pure speculation that we're not supposed

2272
01:36:16,560 --> 01:36:15,130
to remember these past lives and the

2273
01:36:19,170 --> 01:36:16,570
people that do remember them there's

2274
01:36:21,870 --> 01:36:19,180
something wrong and somehow the

2275
01:36:23,310 --> 01:36:21,880
information slips through or maybe

2276
01:36:25,260 --> 01:36:23,320
there's something there very unresolved

2277
01:36:28,380 --> 01:36:25,270
about but I don't know you know

2278
01:36:29,420 --> 01:36:28,390
I can't answer any more I don't know

2279
01:36:32,250 --> 01:36:29,430
what you call those kinds of questions

2280
01:36:34,350 --> 01:36:32,260
but I don't know the answers to any of

2281
01:36:35,910 --> 01:36:34,360
it it's just for me it's just there's

2282
01:36:36,720 --> 01:36:35,920
data and what do you how do you

2283
01:36:40,680 --> 01:36:36,730
interpret it

2284
01:36:43,020 --> 01:36:40,690
I don't know so many questions thing

2285
01:36:44,670 --> 01:36:43,030
that you can't prove I mean yeah I know

2286
01:36:47,640 --> 01:36:44,680
all we can do is look at cases in which

2287
01:36:49,200 --> 01:36:47,650
you know a child remembers there's one

2288
01:36:51,830 --> 01:36:49,210
case the other case that presented book

2289
01:36:55,080 --> 01:36:51,840
he remembered fifty five specific

2290
01:36:57,870 --> 01:36:55,090
accurate memories about the life of

2291
01:36:59,970 --> 01:36:57,880
somebody who died decades before he was

2292
01:37:04,680 --> 01:36:59,980
born and has no connection to him or the

2293
01:37:08,460 --> 01:37:04,690
family and the child has absolutely no

2294
01:37:11,040 --> 01:37:08,470
doubt that he was that person and the

2295
01:37:12,960 --> 01:37:11,050
memories were so accurate and the the

2296
01:37:16,710 --> 01:37:12,970
emotions are so strongly connected with

2297
01:37:18,630 --> 01:37:16,720
it - and so your it does raise the

2298
01:37:20,790 --> 01:37:18,640
question of well therefore does this

2299
01:37:23,370 --> 01:37:20,800
mean we survive death I mean if you even

2300
01:37:25,800 --> 01:37:23,380
have a couple of cases that are strong

2301
01:37:27,840 --> 01:37:25,810
like this what does it mean it looks as

2302
01:37:30,810 --> 01:37:27,850
that person's consciousness has survived

2303
01:37:32,400 --> 01:37:30,820
from one life to the next so what is

2304
01:37:35,580 --> 01:37:32,410
where do we go from there well we have

2305
01:37:37,410 --> 01:37:35,590
to look at can consciousness even exist

2306
01:37:39,390 --> 01:37:37,420
independently of the body first of all

2307
01:37:40,770 --> 01:37:39,400
and then I do explore that question in

2308
01:37:42,630 --> 01:37:40,780
my book and we look at cases of

2309
01:37:44,940 --> 01:37:42,640
veridical OBEs and things like that

2310
01:37:46,560 --> 01:37:44,950
which show that yes consciousness seems

2311
01:37:49,230 --> 01:37:46,570
to be able to exist independently the

2312
01:37:52,290 --> 01:37:49,240
body therefore maybe it can transition

2313
01:37:54,750 --> 01:37:52,300
from one life to another we don't know

2314
01:37:55,920 --> 01:37:54,760
or it may just be that the child is

2315
01:37:57,810 --> 01:37:55,930
remembering something

2316
01:38:00,090 --> 01:37:57,820
there's someone live the life that

2317
01:38:02,370 --> 01:38:00,100
someone lived but it wasn't them being

2318
01:38:04,910 --> 01:38:02,380
reincarnated it's tapping into

2319
01:38:08,250 --> 01:38:04,920
somebody's soul that exists somewhere I

2320
01:38:11,010 --> 01:38:08,260
suppose that's true I mean you'd have to

2321
01:38:13,470 --> 01:38:11,020
ask why that would be the case why would

2322
01:38:15,360 --> 01:38:13,480
it be some one particular person that

2323
01:38:18,090 --> 01:38:15,370
they would tap into or maybe it's

2324
01:38:20,910 --> 01:38:18,100
accidental I mean I don't know we have a

2325
01:38:22,580 --> 01:38:20,920
question from Dave M in in Chad and he

2326
01:38:26,550 --> 01:38:22,590
wants to know what your thoughts are on

2327
01:38:28,560 --> 01:38:26,560
a soul do you believe that the soul is

2328
01:38:30,960 --> 01:38:28,570
the true nature of a human being and

2329
01:38:33,900 --> 01:38:30,970
that's a very deep and loaded question

2330
01:38:35,820 --> 01:38:33,910
but what are your thoughts I mean how

2331
01:38:38,430 --> 01:38:35,830
would he define the word soul that would

2332
01:38:40,950 --> 01:38:38,440
be my initial question when he says soul

2333
01:38:44,100 --> 01:38:40,960
what does he mean is it a religious

2334
01:38:46,700 --> 01:38:44,110
concept is it because I use in my book I

2335
01:38:48,990 --> 01:38:46,710
tend to think of it as consciousness I

2336
01:38:50,430 --> 01:38:49,000
call it consciousness if maybe that's

2337
01:38:52,320 --> 01:38:50,440
the same thing that he's talking about

2338
01:38:53,970 --> 01:38:52,330
when he says soul I don't know to me it

2339
01:38:58,740 --> 01:38:53,980
has sort of a religious connotation to

2340
01:39:02,040 --> 01:38:58,750
it so he's asking what the nature of the

2341
01:39:04,740 --> 01:39:02,050
soul is or did if you believe that the

2342
01:39:09,150 --> 01:39:04,750
soul is the true nature of a human being

2343
01:39:11,310 --> 01:39:09,160
I can't possibly say I mean I it seems

2344
01:39:13,740 --> 01:39:11,320
to me that consciousness I would maybe

2345
01:39:15,180 --> 01:39:13,750
Ward it that way is sort of the essence

2346
01:39:18,120 --> 01:39:15,190
of the human being there is some

2347
01:39:22,830 --> 01:39:18,130
essential spiritual nature it seems to

2348
01:39:24,030 --> 01:39:22,840
me that we all are deep down but I don't

2349
01:39:25,530 --> 01:39:24,040
know I don't know how I would describe

2350
01:39:30,480 --> 01:39:25,540
it or what word I would use to describe

2351
01:39:32,550 --> 01:39:30,490
that okay thank you I also don't claim

2352
01:39:35,340 --> 01:39:32,560
to be the expert any kind of an expert

2353
01:39:37,020 --> 01:39:35,350
on that kind of question either you know

2354
01:39:38,940 --> 01:39:37,030
well right yeah I mean you're good at

2355
01:39:42,600 --> 01:39:38,950
looking at the data presenting

2356
01:39:43,980 --> 01:39:42,610
data and in remaining objective I think

2357
01:39:46,710 --> 01:39:43,990
that's what I'm trying to do but I also

2358
01:39:48,510 --> 01:39:46,720
had my own confounding experiences so

2359
01:39:50,430 --> 01:39:48,520
but I try to be as objective about those

2360
01:39:52,500 --> 01:39:50,440
as I couldn't book as well

2361
01:39:54,600 --> 01:39:52,510
well you referred to experiences with

2362
01:39:58,910 --> 01:39:54,610
mediums anything else you haven't

2363
01:40:01,950 --> 01:39:58,920
mentioned well I did have these

2364
01:40:03,090 --> 01:40:01,960
communications quotes or what you you

2365
01:40:04,710 --> 01:40:03,100
know there are a lot of people there's a

2366
01:40:07,350 --> 01:40:04,720
whole field of study called after-death

2367
01:40:09,510 --> 01:40:07,360
communication so I believe that I I was

2368
01:40:12,150 --> 01:40:09,520
recipient of some of those from my

2369
01:40:13,830 --> 01:40:12,160
brother who died during the course of

2370
01:40:18,030 --> 01:40:13,840
the writing of this book actually in

2371
01:40:22,370 --> 01:40:18,040
2013 so I did have some experiences with

2372
01:40:26,340 --> 01:40:22,380
that that I never expected what happened

2373
01:40:29,550 --> 01:40:26,350
and those are those are in some sense

2374
01:40:31,320 --> 01:40:29,560
they're they're sort of like having the

2375
01:40:33,330 --> 01:40:31,330
experience you might have with a medium

2376
01:40:36,210 --> 01:40:33,340
only their direct there's no

2377
01:40:38,190 --> 01:40:36,220
intermediary so with a medium you're

2378
01:40:40,260 --> 01:40:38,200
depending on this intermediary for the

2379
01:40:42,900 --> 01:40:40,270
information when you have a direct

2380
01:40:44,850 --> 01:40:42,910
communication it's something completely

2381
01:40:48,060 --> 01:40:44,860
different and it has a far bigger impact

2382
01:40:50,640 --> 01:40:48,070
on you but it's also less objective so

2383
01:40:51,900 --> 01:40:50,650
you have an experience you may be the

2384
01:40:55,560 --> 01:40:51,910
only person involved with that

2385
01:40:58,620 --> 01:40:55,570
experience and no you could never prove

2386
01:41:01,140 --> 01:40:58,630
it to anybody else but the impact that

2387
01:41:02,760 --> 01:41:01,150
it has is really intense depending on

2388
01:41:05,330 --> 01:41:02,770
the nature of the experience so it's

2389
01:41:07,980 --> 01:41:05,340
very in some sense it's non evidential

2390
01:41:11,040 --> 01:41:07,990
in that way but so many people have

2391
01:41:13,020 --> 01:41:11,050
these experiences and I I thought about

2392
01:41:14,910 --> 01:41:13,030
maybe not even writing about my own

2393
01:41:16,800 --> 01:41:14,920
better then I thought it wouldn't be an

2394
01:41:18,420 --> 01:41:16,810
honest book if I didn't because these

2395
01:41:20,250 --> 01:41:18,430
experience occurred during the writing

2396
01:41:23,460 --> 01:41:20,260
of the book and they obviously had a big

2397
01:41:25,380 --> 01:41:23,470
effect on me so I as personal as they

2398
01:41:27,030 --> 01:41:25,390
are I thought that it wouldn't be honest

2399
01:41:30,570 --> 01:41:27,040
at me to leave them out so it I did

2400
01:41:33,240 --> 01:41:30,580
include them so that's another component

2401
01:41:36,000 --> 01:41:33,250
of the book these mediums with whom you

2402
01:41:38,160 --> 01:41:36,010
communicated once they delivered results

2403
01:41:40,110 --> 01:41:38,170
that impressed you did you acquaint them

2404
01:41:45,750 --> 01:41:40,120
with who you were and what you were

2405
01:41:48,000 --> 01:41:45,760
doing yes I did and I know accurate they

2406
01:41:50,640 --> 01:41:48,010
were and then I also did interviews with

2407
01:41:52,500 --> 01:41:50,650
them and wrote about in the book you

2408
01:41:54,180 --> 01:41:52,510
know after the fact just try

2409
01:41:56,399 --> 01:41:54,190
to get to the bottom of how they do what

2410
01:41:58,109 --> 01:41:56,409
they do what is you know what how do

2411
01:41:59,850 --> 01:41:58,119
they differentiate this is a big

2412
01:42:01,799 --> 01:41:59,860
question I wanted to ask these mediums

2413
01:42:05,279 --> 01:42:01,809
how do they differentiate between

2414
01:42:07,140 --> 01:42:05,289
information that is coming from what

2415
01:42:09,870 --> 01:42:07,150
they call the spirit world is coming

2416
01:42:11,910 --> 01:42:09,880
from the deceased person as opposed to

2417
01:42:13,560 --> 01:42:11,920
information that's from their own

2418
01:42:16,109 --> 01:42:13,570
psychic ability and how do they

2419
01:42:17,819 --> 01:42:16,119
distinguish between those two because

2420
01:42:20,580 --> 01:42:17,829
that's the bottom line question when it

2421
01:42:22,379 --> 01:42:20,590
comes to evidence for survival you want

2422
01:42:24,330 --> 01:42:22,389
to know are these mediums how do they

2423
01:42:26,189 --> 01:42:24,340
know they're speaking they're getting

2424
01:42:28,709 --> 01:42:26,199
information from a deceased person or

2425
01:42:31,259 --> 01:42:28,719
from a spirit person so I did these

2426
01:42:32,459 --> 01:42:31,269
interviews with both the mediums in

2427
01:42:34,410 --> 01:42:32,469
which I asked them those kinds of

2428
01:42:36,359 --> 01:42:34,420
questions and ask them about their

2429
01:42:39,330 --> 01:42:36,369
process what what they how they do it

2430
01:42:41,430 --> 01:42:39,340
those kinds of questions so yeah so they

2431
01:42:43,169 --> 01:42:41,440
they did find out after the after the

2432
01:42:44,370 --> 01:42:43,179
readings that I was writing a book on it

2433
01:42:48,029 --> 01:42:44,380
but they didn't know anything about that

2434
01:42:51,180 --> 01:42:48,039
before the readings do they both use the

2435
01:42:53,370 --> 01:42:51,190
same process their styles are somewhat

2436
01:42:55,589 --> 01:42:53,380
different it's similar it's basically

2437
01:42:57,629 --> 01:42:55,599
sort of the same problem in essence it's

2438
01:43:00,000 --> 01:42:57,639
the same process where they're sort of

2439
01:43:02,790 --> 01:43:00,010
acting like this telephone wire to this

2440
01:43:04,080 --> 01:43:02,800
to the other side as they call it and

2441
01:43:06,209 --> 01:43:04,090
they're bringing in information but

2442
01:43:08,430 --> 01:43:06,219
they're the two styles that they have

2443
01:43:12,089 --> 01:43:08,440
were quite different one of them was

2444
01:43:17,419 --> 01:43:12,099
more was longer more in-depth very full

2445
01:43:22,109 --> 01:43:17,429
of spiritual energy and it was just a

2446
01:43:24,479 --> 01:43:22,119
full of light and energy and details and

2447
01:43:26,819 --> 01:43:24,489
the other the second medium was shorter

2448
01:43:28,410 --> 01:43:26,829
and very very specific like almost like

2449
01:43:29,910 --> 01:43:28,420
a series of bullet points she would just

2450
01:43:33,180 --> 01:43:29,920
say Bing Bing Bing

2451
01:43:36,180 --> 01:43:33,190
okay Bing Bing Bing and these facts

2452
01:43:39,029 --> 01:43:36,190
would just come out of her that she said

2453
01:43:41,970 --> 01:43:39,039
we're being delivered by this person so

2454
01:43:43,319 --> 01:43:41,980
but the essential essential process is

2455
01:43:45,149 --> 01:43:43,329
the same they're they're basically

2456
01:43:48,479 --> 01:43:45,159
putting out an antenna into this other

2457
01:43:51,000 --> 01:43:48,489
world and receiving information that's

2458
01:43:52,740 --> 01:43:51,010
that the sitter me was drawing to

2459
01:43:54,419 --> 01:43:52,750
through them because of my connection to

2460
01:43:57,810 --> 01:43:54,429
that person on the other side that's how

2461
01:43:59,160 --> 01:43:57,820
they explained what's going on now this

2462
01:44:01,649 --> 01:43:59,170
might be different for each one of these

2463
01:44:04,259 --> 01:44:01,659
mediums did they learn how to do this by

2464
01:44:05,150 --> 01:44:04,269
accident did they do research do they

2465
01:44:08,390 --> 01:44:05,160
take a course

2466
01:44:10,790 --> 01:44:08,400
what no I mean the two that I've got to

2467
01:44:13,010 --> 01:44:10,800
know here Sandra and Laura both were

2468
01:44:16,490 --> 01:44:13,020
born basically with these abilities they

2469
01:44:18,110 --> 01:44:16,500
grew up with them and they initially

2470
01:44:19,160 --> 01:44:18,120
believed that everybody you know it's

2471
01:44:21,350 --> 01:44:19,170
like the boy in the sixth sense

2472
01:44:24,290 --> 01:44:21,360
everybody sees dead people right or

2473
01:44:26,900 --> 01:44:24,300
everybody knows when their grandfather's

2474
01:44:29,420 --> 01:44:26,910
gonna die in a week and they gradually

2475
01:44:31,150 --> 01:44:29,430
learned that that was not the case but

2476
01:44:33,950 --> 01:44:31,160
it was just a completely natural

2477
01:44:36,500 --> 01:44:33,960
abilities that they had now they

2478
01:44:38,420 --> 01:44:36,510
struggled with it Sandra describes just

2479
01:44:40,370 --> 01:44:38,430
completely turning them off at one point

2480
01:44:42,260 --> 01:44:40,380
because she just wanted to be a regular

2481
01:44:45,320 --> 01:44:42,270
teenage girl she didn't want these

2482
01:44:47,150 --> 01:44:45,330
things happening to her so I think my

2483
01:44:49,100 --> 01:44:47,160
sense of really good medium is it's very

2484
01:44:51,470 --> 01:44:49,110
hard to go to school and learn how to do

2485
01:44:53,030 --> 01:44:51,480
this that's two-thirds of the episode

2486
01:44:54,890 --> 01:44:53,040
we've got a lot more to come with our

2487
01:44:58,070 --> 01:44:54,900
guests Leslie Cain and guest co-host

2488
01:45:01,190 --> 01:44:58,080
Erica Luke's as I said Chris O'Brien is

2489
01:45:03,140 --> 01:45:01,200
off on special assignment catching up on

2490
01:45:04,940 --> 01:45:03,150
things that will help improve his bottom

2491
01:45:08,260 --> 01:45:04,950
line so he'll be back soon

2492
01:45:11,960 --> 01:45:08,270
in the meantime we will continue

2493
01:45:16,100 --> 01:45:11,970
learning more about possible survival

2494
01:45:18,530 --> 01:45:16,110
after death and lots more things and by

2495
01:45:21,890 --> 01:45:18,540
the way don't forget to go to plus PL us

2496
01:45:24,800 --> 01:45:21,900
doctor para cast com to learn about the

2497
01:45:28,070 --> 01:45:24,810
para cast plus in our special show after

2498
01:45:37,169 --> 01:45:28,080
the para cast Erica Luke's is our guest

2499
01:45:37,179 --> 01:45:42,189
thank you for listening to GCN

2500
01:45:49,689 --> 01:45:47,739
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2524
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2525
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2526
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2527
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2528
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2538
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2539
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2540
01:47:26,500 --> 01:47:25,670
reducer found in hundreds of

2541
01:47:29,109 --> 01:47:26,510
over-the-counter and prescription

2542
01:47:30,459 --> 01:47:29,119
medicines but taking too much or more

2543
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than one medication containing

2544
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2546
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take acetaminophen if you drink three or

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more alcoholic drinks every day to learn

2548
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more visit fda.gov slash OTC pain info a

2549
01:47:45,160 --> 01:47:43,820
message from the US Department of Health

2550
01:47:55,100 --> 01:47:45,170
and Human Services Food and Drug

2551
01:48:03,140 --> 01:47:58,800
welcome back into the para cast the gold

2552
01:48:12,210 --> 01:48:03,150
standard of paranormal radio and now

2553
01:48:14,340 --> 01:48:12,220
here's Jane Steinberg so Lesley Kane

2554
01:48:16,800 --> 01:48:14,350
let's go into that process a little bit

2555
01:48:20,310 --> 01:48:16,810
further so this is something that came

2556
01:48:22,170 --> 01:48:20,320
naturally to them but what is their

2557
01:48:24,300 --> 01:48:22,180
process do they go into some kind of

2558
01:48:27,660 --> 01:48:24,310
trance does it just happen

2559
01:48:29,850 --> 01:48:27,670
do they have to focus themselves in a

2560
01:48:32,070 --> 01:48:29,860
certain way to tune into the needs of a

2561
01:48:33,570 --> 01:48:32,080
particular person well the the mental

2562
01:48:36,120 --> 01:48:33,580
medium such as what we're talking about

2563
01:48:38,550 --> 01:48:36,130
now don't go into trance they're in full

2564
01:48:40,350 --> 01:48:38,560
waking consciousness and I think they

2565
01:48:42,180 --> 01:48:40,360
all have their own process that they

2566
01:48:43,980 --> 01:48:42,190
might go through right before reading

2567
01:48:46,680 --> 01:48:43,990
where they sit quietly with themselves

2568
01:48:48,680 --> 01:48:46,690
or tune in or do you know they have

2569
01:48:51,030 --> 01:48:48,690
their own little rituals that they do

2570
01:48:52,740 --> 01:48:51,040
but when you're on the phone with them

2571
01:48:54,600 --> 01:48:52,750
they're just fully present it's like a

2572
01:48:56,700 --> 01:48:54,610
regular conversation you'd have with

2573
01:48:58,140 --> 01:48:56,710
anybody they're just delivering this

2574
01:49:00,480 --> 01:48:58,150
information and you're sitting there

2575
01:49:02,460 --> 01:49:00,490
having your mind blown by the accuracy

2576
01:49:05,220 --> 01:49:02,470
of it but there's no trance there's

2577
01:49:08,400 --> 01:49:05,230
nothing weird about it at all it's just

2578
01:49:10,080 --> 01:49:08,410
okay you know they'll say no I hear

2579
01:49:12,720 --> 01:49:10,090
such-and-such and they'll they'll give

2580
01:49:15,690 --> 01:49:12,730
you information and sometimes the

2581
01:49:17,310 --> 01:49:15,700
information is sort of the interesting

2582
01:49:19,520 --> 01:49:17,320
thing is they often don't know what

2583
01:49:22,110 --> 01:49:19,530
they're saying or what it even means

2584
01:49:23,760 --> 01:49:22,120
they will say something that you have to

2585
01:49:26,310 --> 01:49:23,770
interpret and they will ask you if it

2586
01:49:27,810 --> 01:49:26,320
makes sense as long as it makes sense to

2587
01:49:29,250 --> 01:49:27,820
you they're satisfied but they don't

2588
01:49:31,740 --> 01:49:29,260
usually even know what the information

2589
01:49:33,780 --> 01:49:31,750
means themselves which is you know

2590
01:49:35,490 --> 01:49:33,790
another reason that another point

2591
01:49:37,290 --> 01:49:35,500
suggesting that it's pretty hard to fake

2592
01:49:38,790 --> 01:49:37,300
these things I'm trying I'm putting

2593
01:49:41,430 --> 01:49:38,800
through the book here I mean certainly

2594
01:49:43,980 --> 01:49:41,440
here's an example like them I remember

2595
01:49:45,810 --> 01:49:43,990
from one of them for instance when

2596
01:49:48,030 --> 01:49:45,820
Sandra was bringing through information

2597
01:49:50,580 --> 01:49:48,040
connected to Budd Hopkins she said at

2598
01:49:52,500 --> 01:49:50,590
one point the month of April she

2599
01:49:54,870 --> 01:49:52,510
referred to them too the word April

2600
01:49:56,700 --> 01:49:54,880
having significance but she didn't know

2601
01:49:58,500 --> 01:49:56,710
why or what it meant and it turns out

2602
01:50:00,450 --> 01:49:58,510
that but we were even talking about buds

2603
01:50:02,430 --> 01:50:00,460
family and his

2604
01:50:05,370 --> 01:50:02,440
second wife who was the mother of his

2605
01:50:06,959 --> 01:50:05,380
daughter his name was April and then she

2606
01:50:10,020 --> 01:50:06,969
would say something that I hear the song

2607
01:50:11,790 --> 01:50:10,030
Amazing Grace and she didn't know why

2608
01:50:14,670 --> 01:50:11,800
either and it turns out that Bud's

2609
01:50:15,930 --> 01:50:14,680
daughter was named Grace there's a lot

2610
01:50:18,030 --> 01:50:15,940
of things that come through like that

2611
01:50:19,890 --> 01:50:18,040
where they're the medium doesn't know

2612
01:50:22,260 --> 01:50:19,900
what it means but it has a great meaning

2613
01:50:23,850 --> 01:50:22,270
to the person listening and the way this

2614
01:50:26,370 --> 01:50:23,860
is happening there's no way she could

2615
01:50:28,050 --> 01:50:26,380
look up a bio of Budd Hopkins because

2616
01:50:31,020 --> 01:50:28,060
she doesn't even know that's the person

2617
01:50:33,780 --> 01:50:31,030
you're trying to contact exactly because

2618
01:50:35,370 --> 01:50:33,790
she didn't even know my name so she

2619
01:50:36,900 --> 01:50:35,380
couldn't have even looked me up ahead of

2620
01:50:38,070 --> 01:50:36,910
time she didn't know my name she didn't

2621
01:50:40,080 --> 01:50:38,080
know anything about me

2622
01:50:41,970 --> 01:50:40,090
what's really something sometimes

2623
01:50:45,510 --> 01:50:41,980
they'll get the name of the person - I

2624
01:50:47,910 --> 01:50:45,520
think she did get Sandra said his name

2625
01:50:50,280 --> 01:50:47,920
was bubby or Bob or something it was

2626
01:50:52,080 --> 01:50:50,290
very close to the real name oh then I

2627
01:50:54,090 --> 01:50:52,090
think she might have even gotten the

2628
01:50:56,640 --> 01:50:54,100
name Elliott yeah I have to find it in

2629
01:50:59,070 --> 01:50:56,650
my book but I do list all the specific

2630
01:51:01,050 --> 01:50:59,080
things that she did say for people who

2631
01:51:02,729 --> 01:51:01,060
read this book and they're very stunning

2632
01:51:04,530 --> 01:51:02,739
this is one of the ones that really

2633
01:51:06,600 --> 01:51:04,540
stood out for me with Budd Hopkins as

2634
01:51:08,640 --> 01:51:06,610
I'll never forget it she said you're

2635
01:51:10,260 --> 01:51:08,650
gonna think I'm completely nuts and I

2636
01:51:12,930 --> 01:51:10,270
don't know what any of this means but

2637
01:51:16,920 --> 01:51:12,940
here goes and she says do you remember

2638
01:51:19,530 --> 01:51:16,930
that the movie 80 and I say yes and she

2639
01:51:22,860 --> 01:51:19,540
says well I'm getting a picture of the

2640
01:51:24,630 --> 01:51:22,870
little boy in the movie pointing at the

2641
01:51:28,740 --> 01:51:24,640
alien or pointing at the creature and

2642
01:51:30,120 --> 01:51:28,750
saying Elliott Elliott he said I don't

2643
01:51:32,160 --> 01:51:30,130
know why I'm giving you this but there

2644
01:51:35,010 --> 01:51:32,170
it is what was so stunning about that

2645
01:51:38,310 --> 01:51:35,020
was not only did it involve an alien

2646
01:51:38,610 --> 01:51:38,320
being which bud studied for his whole

2647
01:51:40,229 --> 01:51:38,620
life

2648
01:51:43,410 --> 01:51:40,239
you know his whole career in the UFO

2649
01:51:45,930 --> 01:51:43,420
field was studying abductions by alien

2650
01:51:48,600 --> 01:51:45,940
beings but the second part of it was

2651
01:51:50,100 --> 01:51:48,610
that his name was Elliott bugs actual

2652
01:51:51,810 --> 01:51:50,110
real name was and his first name was

2653
01:51:54,350 --> 01:51:51,820
Elliott and so here you have a double

2654
01:51:58,260 --> 01:51:54,360
whammy you have this young boy

2655
01:52:00,390 --> 01:51:58,270
mentioning the name of the person the

2656
01:52:02,940 --> 01:52:00,400
deceased person and also pointing to an

2657
01:52:05,190 --> 01:52:02,950
alien and this was from a woman who knew

2658
01:52:07,680 --> 01:52:05,200
nothing about who this person was or

2659
01:52:10,020 --> 01:52:07,690
what his interest was this just came out

2660
01:52:11,690 --> 01:52:10,030
came through her I thought that was you

2661
01:52:13,839 --> 01:52:11,700
know that was a very very specific

2662
01:52:17,530 --> 01:52:13,849
that's what was so powerful about

2663
01:52:19,089 --> 01:52:17,540
very specific that is fascinating yeah

2664
01:52:20,620 --> 01:52:19,099
when they say general things like you

2665
01:52:22,419 --> 01:52:20,630
know this is another trick that mediums

2666
01:52:24,010 --> 01:52:22,429
will do or or you might have a reading

2667
01:52:26,740 --> 01:52:24,020
that's not very powerful the meaning

2668
01:52:29,859 --> 01:52:26,750
will say very generalized thing like oh

2669
01:52:32,470 --> 01:52:29,869
this person loved you very much or oh

2670
01:52:34,240 --> 01:52:32,480
this person had a great sense of humor

2671
01:52:36,399 --> 01:52:34,250
or this person says that maybe you don't

2672
01:52:38,879 --> 01:52:36,409
feel confident right now about your job

2673
01:52:40,540 --> 01:52:38,889
or you know sort of basic

2674
01:52:43,000 --> 01:52:40,550
generalizations like that that could

2675
01:52:44,859 --> 01:52:43,010
apply to a lot of people but when they

2676
01:52:47,680 --> 01:52:44,869
say something extremely Pacific's

2677
01:52:49,959 --> 01:52:47,690
involving names that's a different a

2678
01:52:51,970 --> 01:52:49,969
different word and and this medium was

2679
01:52:53,410 --> 01:52:51,980
doing that a lot in the reading well I

2680
01:52:55,330 --> 01:52:53,420
think it's important to when you know

2681
01:52:57,580 --> 01:52:55,340
with mediums I mean they're they won't

2682
01:52:59,830 --> 01:52:57,590
always be right it's incredibly

2683
01:53:02,350 --> 01:52:59,840
difficult to tap into information and I

2684
01:53:05,109 --> 01:53:02,360
think a good medium will also be very

2685
01:53:07,419 --> 01:53:05,119
forthright about that you know you can't

2686
01:53:09,160 --> 01:53:07,429
get everything correctly just like you

2687
01:53:11,350 --> 01:53:09,170
can't when you're researching UFOs this

2688
01:53:13,000 --> 01:53:11,360
is an unknown and sometimes you have

2689
01:53:16,120 --> 01:53:13,010
access to things and sometimes you don't

2690
01:53:19,000 --> 01:53:16,130
but this is an important area of study

2691
01:53:21,250 --> 01:53:19,010
and there are people that have gifts in

2692
01:53:23,109 --> 01:53:21,260
this regard which I think we all do and

2693
01:53:25,720 --> 01:53:23,119
I want to ask you a question about that

2694
01:53:28,629 --> 01:53:25,730
I mean do you think that if we all had

2695
01:53:30,879 --> 01:53:28,639
good meditation practice or we were

2696
01:53:33,550 --> 01:53:30,889
spiritual or we really dedicated a

2697
01:53:35,979 --> 01:53:33,560
portion of study to this could we tap

2698
01:53:38,290 --> 01:53:35,989
into some of these own things that

2699
01:53:41,530 --> 01:53:38,300
mediums do intuitive's to pick up

2700
01:53:43,030 --> 01:53:41,540
messages gosh I have no idea Eric I mean

2701
01:53:44,890 --> 01:53:43,040
I'm assuming everybody's different and

2702
01:53:47,709 --> 01:53:44,900
everybody has a different way of

2703
01:53:51,089 --> 01:53:47,719
connecting and I would have no idea I

2704
01:53:53,319 --> 01:53:51,099
bet you know more about that than I do

2705
01:53:56,290 --> 01:53:53,329
it is fascinating because I've always

2706
01:53:58,330 --> 01:53:56,300
studied I believe personally that we all

2707
01:54:00,640 --> 01:53:58,340
have an intuitive ability I think that's

2708
01:54:03,430 --> 01:54:00,650
just part of us but I think through time

2709
01:54:05,859 --> 01:54:03,440
through just we're being dumbed down and

2710
01:54:07,689 --> 01:54:05,869
so we're not accessing that intuitive

2711
01:54:10,060 --> 01:54:07,699
ability or we're not appreciating it

2712
01:54:14,020 --> 01:54:10,070
enough we become so over overly

2713
01:54:15,700 --> 01:54:14,030
sensitized with things so it's it's

2714
01:54:17,229 --> 01:54:15,710
curious but we do all have that it and

2715
01:54:20,379 --> 01:54:17,239
it's amazing to see some people that are

2716
01:54:22,629 --> 01:54:20,389
really honed in on their skills great

2717
01:54:24,370 --> 01:54:22,639
yeah it's amazing and it's true mediums

2718
01:54:25,089 --> 01:54:24,380
are not always accurate of course and in

2719
01:54:26,859 --> 01:54:25,099
every

2720
01:54:28,330 --> 01:54:26,869
in the reading I had with Sandra that it

2721
01:54:30,069 --> 01:54:28,340
was so extraordinary there were some

2722
01:54:32,049 --> 01:54:30,079
things she said that made no sense at

2723
01:54:34,449 --> 01:54:32,059
all to me and their understanding of

2724
01:54:36,639 --> 01:54:34,459
that is when that happens what Sandra

2725
01:54:39,580 --> 01:54:36,649
told me was she feels that it's because

2726
01:54:41,849 --> 01:54:39,590
she's not properly interpreting what's

2727
01:54:44,560 --> 01:54:41,859
being given to her they have to sort of

2728
01:54:47,020 --> 01:54:44,570
interpret sometimes they're just she

2729
01:54:49,209 --> 01:54:47,030
says it's like seeing colors or seeing

2730
01:54:51,549 --> 01:54:49,219
images or hearing something and they

2731
01:54:54,279 --> 01:54:51,559
have to interpret it to a certain extent

2732
01:54:55,750 --> 01:54:54,289
or somehow you know bring it forward in

2733
01:54:57,639 --> 01:54:55,760
a way that connects with the sitter and

2734
01:54:59,379 --> 01:54:57,649
she feels like sometimes she isn't able

2735
01:55:01,139 --> 01:54:59,389
to do that and that's why some of the

2736
01:55:05,500 --> 01:55:01,149
information doesn't come out accurately

2737
01:55:07,060 --> 01:55:05,510
so is it also possible here then if they

2738
01:55:10,659 --> 01:55:07,070
have such abilities they only come

2739
01:55:12,459 --> 01:55:10,669
through every so often so most the time

2740
01:55:14,199 --> 01:55:12,469
they're kind of faking it they're doing

2741
01:55:16,509 --> 01:55:14,209
cold readings and then every so often

2742
01:55:18,879 --> 01:55:16,519
they get something that has more

2743
01:55:21,250 --> 01:55:18,889
significance I mean it may be true for

2744
01:55:22,839 --> 01:55:21,260
some mediums I don't think that Sandra

2745
01:55:24,549 --> 01:55:22,849
would probably be doing cold readings I

2746
01:55:27,129 --> 01:55:24,559
think she would be maybe just providing

2747
01:55:29,319 --> 01:55:27,139
a lot of inaccurate information and for

2748
01:55:30,669 --> 01:55:29,329
whatever reason because when you and you

2749
01:55:32,229 --> 01:55:30,679
don't know who the person is and you're

2750
01:55:34,750 --> 01:55:32,239
on the phone you can't really do cold

2751
01:55:37,029 --> 01:55:34,760
readings very easily or she she just may

2752
01:55:38,889 --> 01:55:37,039
be inaccurate so I don't know I I know

2753
01:55:40,869 --> 01:55:38,899
that there is a lot of inconsistency

2754
01:55:42,279 --> 01:55:40,879
from one reading to the next for

2755
01:55:45,879 --> 01:55:42,289
whatever there could be multiple reasons

2756
01:55:48,609 --> 01:55:45,889
for that so you can't and you're not

2757
01:55:51,369 --> 01:55:48,619
gonna get a 90% accuracy every reading

2758
01:55:54,159 --> 01:55:51,379
the medium does that's for sure so there

2759
01:55:55,949 --> 01:55:54,169
is a variation and I did some readings

2760
01:55:58,270 --> 01:55:55,959
with some mediums that weren't so good

2761
01:55:59,979 --> 01:55:58,280
you know these I wrote about the ones

2762
01:56:01,869 --> 01:55:59,989
that stood out because those the ones

2763
01:56:05,319 --> 01:56:01,879
that are interesting but they're not

2764
01:56:07,239 --> 01:56:05,329
always you might go to a medium somebody

2765
01:56:09,099 --> 01:56:07,249
might recommend to you a medium that

2766
01:56:10,959 --> 01:56:09,109
they said was absolutely incredible for

2767
01:56:14,259 --> 01:56:10,969
them and you might go and and find it

2768
01:56:17,529 --> 01:56:14,269
was absolutely meaningless for you can't

2769
01:56:19,629 --> 01:56:17,539
predict you you really can't and I think

2770
01:56:21,310 --> 01:56:19,639
you connect with some people just like

2771
01:56:24,759 --> 01:56:21,320
you do in everyday life and and each

2772
01:56:27,209 --> 01:56:24,769
medium has a specific gift you know some

2773
01:56:30,250 --> 01:56:27,219
people some mediums are better at

2774
01:56:32,649 --> 01:56:30,260
listening and picking up things audibly

2775
01:56:34,959 --> 01:56:32,659
some people can see things and and so

2776
01:56:36,310 --> 01:56:34,969
it's always interesting to to know the

2777
01:56:38,209 --> 01:56:36,320
different types of mediums that you're

2778
01:56:41,569 --> 01:56:38,219
dealing with and their specific gifts

2779
01:56:44,629 --> 01:56:41,579
I agree yeah you can't predict and and

2780
01:56:46,370 --> 01:56:44,639
again you can't also understand if the

2781
01:56:48,140 --> 01:56:46,380
what the process is whether they're

2782
01:56:50,239 --> 01:56:48,150
dealing with their own psychic abilities

2783
01:56:52,549 --> 01:56:50,249
or whether they actually actually are

2784
01:56:54,649 --> 01:56:52,559
connecting with your dead loved person

2785
01:56:57,439 --> 01:56:54,659
they you know loved one there's just no

2786
01:56:59,000 --> 01:56:57,449
way to know also to prove it one way or

2787
01:57:01,009 --> 01:56:59,010
the other and the best research we can

2788
01:57:02,660 --> 01:57:01,019
do is to do very controlled experiments

2789
01:57:05,299 --> 01:57:02,670
that show that they can get accurate

2790
01:57:08,839 --> 01:57:05,309
information and then we can ask them to

2791
01:57:11,569 --> 01:57:08,849
try to explain to us how they know that

2792
01:57:13,669 --> 01:57:11,579
this information is coming from a

2793
01:57:16,549 --> 01:57:13,679
deceased person as opposed to from their

2794
01:57:19,219 --> 01:57:16,559
own psychic abilities and that's beyond

2795
01:57:21,140 --> 01:57:19,229
that there's not too much more studies

2796
01:57:23,509 --> 01:57:21,150
that can be done except to look at their

2797
01:57:26,569 --> 01:57:23,519
brains that's an interesting area of

2798
01:57:28,390 --> 01:57:26,579
study is to look at the brains of their

2799
01:57:31,270 --> 01:57:28,400
mediums while they're doing readings

2800
01:57:34,310 --> 01:57:31,280
more about that in scientific research

2801
01:57:37,390 --> 01:57:34,320
into life after death

2802
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Leslie Kane Jean Steinberg Erica Luke's

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comment or question about the para cast

2900
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2901
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that's news at the para cast calm and

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don't forget to visit our famous para

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para cast comm for three more segments

2905
02:02:15,670 --> 02:02:14,000
and also Erica Luke's will be giving

2906
02:02:18,520 --> 02:02:15,680
some more questions from our listeners

2907
02:02:20,380 --> 02:02:18,530
so Lesley Kahne as we look into all

2908
02:02:22,330 --> 02:02:20,390
sorts of possibilities here now you

2909
02:02:24,910 --> 02:02:22,340
mentioned the two mediums that impressed

2910
02:02:27,670 --> 02:02:24,920
you said things that just seemed uncanny

2911
02:02:29,560 --> 02:02:27,680
did you get an overall batting average

2912
02:02:31,810 --> 02:02:29,570
on how well they did it was just a

2913
02:02:34,360 --> 02:02:31,820
couple of flashes in the pan or was it

2914
02:02:35,979 --> 02:02:34,370
really really consistently high it was

2915
02:02:38,950 --> 02:02:35,989
consistently high for both of them and

2916
02:02:40,900 --> 02:02:38,960
there are some systemic ways of

2917
02:02:42,340 --> 02:02:40,910
analyzing what they tell you first of

2918
02:02:45,490 --> 02:02:42,350
all you record it so you can write down

2919
02:02:48,880 --> 02:02:45,500
everything and you can rate each point

2920
02:02:51,670 --> 02:02:48,890
that they make as being accurate or semi

2921
02:02:53,020 --> 02:02:51,680
accurate or wrong or unknown you have

2922
02:02:54,910 --> 02:02:53,030
there's a whole way of rating the

2923
02:02:57,550 --> 02:02:54,920
information and then getting a

2924
02:03:00,370 --> 02:02:57,560
percentage and both of these mediums had

2925
02:03:02,410 --> 02:03:00,380
very high percentages for me so I did

2926
02:03:05,950 --> 02:03:02,420
use techniques that have been developed

2927
02:03:09,370 --> 02:03:05,960
by people who study mediums to analyze

2928
02:03:10,990 --> 02:03:09,380
the readings that I got so they were but

2929
02:03:13,360 --> 02:03:11,000
that's not as I said that's not always

2930
02:03:15,130 --> 02:03:13,370
the way it works but I was fortunate not

2931
02:03:17,140 --> 02:03:15,140
to have two very outstanding readings

2932
02:03:21,300 --> 02:03:17,150
where I'd say there were 85 to 95%

2933
02:03:23,590 --> 02:03:21,310
accurate which is very high so it is

2934
02:03:25,540 --> 02:03:23,600
Erica any more questions from listeners

2935
02:03:26,770 --> 02:03:25,550
you know what I there was another

2936
02:03:28,690 --> 02:03:26,780
question and I'm sorry I'm having

2937
02:03:30,520 --> 02:03:28,700
Internet issues right now but the

2938
02:03:34,209 --> 02:03:30,530
question that stood out to me with

2939
02:03:36,610 --> 02:03:34,219
regard to mediums was do they just do

2940
02:03:39,160 --> 02:03:36,620
some of these mediums experience

2941
02:03:40,750 --> 02:03:39,170
negative effects when they're dealing

2942
02:03:42,729 --> 02:03:40,760
with this and I'm gonna elaborate a

2943
02:03:45,280 --> 02:03:42,739
little bit on this but you know when you

2944
02:03:46,900 --> 02:03:45,290
talk about being psychic or kind of

2945
02:03:51,300 --> 02:03:46,910
opening yourself up to some of these

2946
02:03:55,209 --> 02:03:51,310
lower realms lower level entities

2947
02:03:56,709 --> 02:03:55,219
energies did you find that that was any

2948
02:03:58,479 --> 02:03:56,719
of these mediums that you worked with

2949
02:04:00,370 --> 02:03:58,489
did they have any way to protect

2950
02:04:01,720 --> 02:04:00,380
themselves or did that even enter into

2951
02:04:03,550 --> 02:04:01,730
their pick

2952
02:04:05,530 --> 02:04:03,560
that's a really interesting question I

2953
02:04:07,510 --> 02:04:05,540
never asked them about that actually the

2954
02:04:09,970 --> 02:04:07,520
two that I interviewed I never asked

2955
02:04:12,640 --> 02:04:09,980
them that question and I've never heard

2956
02:04:15,790 --> 02:04:12,650
them express that that happened to them

2957
02:04:17,620 --> 02:04:15,800
either and Laurel and Jackson has

2958
02:04:19,480 --> 02:04:17,630
written a book which I've read and she

2959
02:04:21,250 --> 02:04:19,490
doesn't didn't express any issues with

2960
02:04:23,920 --> 02:04:21,260
that either so I don't know I'm assuming

2961
02:04:25,450 --> 02:04:23,930
that that must be an issue for some of

2962
02:04:28,570 --> 02:04:25,460
the mediums who open themselves up to

2963
02:04:30,070 --> 02:04:28,580
this they have to protect themselves but

2964
02:04:32,740 --> 02:04:30,080
I don't know anything about it

2965
02:04:35,200 --> 02:04:32,750
unfortunately okay well I mean it's and

2966
02:04:37,330 --> 02:04:35,210
it's an interesting question and I think

2967
02:04:40,140 --> 02:04:37,340
that of people that I have have worked

2968
02:04:42,550 --> 02:04:40,150
with in in anywhere on the paranormal

2969
02:04:44,560 --> 02:04:42,560
some of these sorts of things I have

2970
02:04:47,590 --> 02:04:44,570
friends that are quite gifted intuitive

2971
02:04:50,020 --> 02:04:47,600
and mediums and you know they talk a lot

2972
02:04:52,030 --> 02:04:50,030
about that and needing to especially

2973
02:04:54,700 --> 02:04:52,040
when you're empathetic really drawing

2974
02:04:57,340 --> 02:04:54,710
barriers so you're not taking on other

2975
02:04:59,890 --> 02:04:57,350
people's negativity or something that we

2976
02:05:04,180 --> 02:04:59,900
don't really have an understanding of so

2977
02:05:08,380 --> 02:05:04,190
it's it's a question it is an

2978
02:05:10,480 --> 02:05:08,390
interesting question so it goes what do

2979
02:05:14,200 --> 02:05:10,490
you think scientists ought to be doing

2980
02:05:16,440 --> 02:05:14,210
to try to nail down this phenomenon and

2981
02:05:18,730 --> 02:05:16,450
get some answers or is it even possible

2982
02:05:21,520 --> 02:05:18,740
well it's such a great question I don't

2983
02:05:23,350 --> 02:05:21,530
think it's possible to prove that we

2984
02:05:25,900 --> 02:05:23,360
survive death no matter what scientists

2985
02:05:27,760 --> 02:05:25,910
do I doubt that that's possible but I

2986
02:05:29,560 --> 02:05:27,770
think that first of all I wish the

2987
02:05:32,050 --> 02:05:29,570
scientists there was more curiosity

2988
02:05:35,560 --> 02:05:32,060
among them but I wish that they were

2989
02:05:38,350 --> 02:05:35,570
more accepting of the fact that these

2990
02:05:41,170 --> 02:05:38,360
phenomena even occur which many of them

2991
02:05:42,790 --> 02:05:41,180
aren't and of course the ones that are

2992
02:05:45,280 --> 02:05:42,800
as some of the ones who I mentioned

2993
02:05:48,090 --> 02:05:45,290
earlier in this program you know some of

2994
02:05:51,640 --> 02:05:48,100
these great great medical doctors

2995
02:05:54,700 --> 02:05:51,650
cardiologists psychologists philosophers

2996
02:05:57,190 --> 02:05:54,710
who have who have devoted themselves to

2997
02:05:58,300 --> 02:05:57,200
studying this very scientifically have

2998
02:06:00,430 --> 02:05:58,310
done great work and make great

2999
02:06:02,620 --> 02:06:00,440
contributions dr. Ian Stevenson for

3000
02:06:06,610 --> 02:06:02,630
instance a psychiatrist from University

3001
02:06:09,190 --> 02:06:06,620
of Virginia but there aren't but I think

3002
02:06:10,750 --> 02:06:09,200
the general attitude of the scientific

3003
02:06:12,820 --> 02:06:10,760
community is that these things just

3004
02:06:15,129 --> 02:06:12,830
don't exist I mean that's the bottom

3005
02:06:17,560 --> 02:06:15,139
line for a lot of people

3006
02:06:20,889 --> 02:06:17,570
and to even just get the point across

3007
02:06:21,790 --> 02:06:20,899
the these kinds of you know psychic

3008
02:06:24,639 --> 02:06:21,800
powers

3009
02:06:26,229 --> 02:06:24,649
for instance that mediums have for

3010
02:06:28,330 --> 02:06:26,239
instance and that's just one component

3011
02:06:30,459 --> 02:06:28,340
of the the kind of information that I

3012
02:06:33,959 --> 02:06:30,469
bring forward in my book but any of it

3013
02:06:37,209 --> 02:06:33,969
but it even exists is is the first step

3014
02:06:38,679 --> 02:06:37,219
it's just like with UFOs I mean a lot of

3015
02:06:40,839 --> 02:06:38,689
the purpose of a book was to just make

3016
02:06:43,569 --> 02:06:40,849
the point that the phenomenon is real

3017
02:06:45,699 --> 02:06:43,579
and here's how we know it same thing

3018
02:06:47,919 --> 02:06:45,709
with this the phenomena that occur are

3019
02:06:51,000 --> 02:06:47,929
real and how they can be how to

3020
02:06:52,929 --> 02:06:51,010
interpret them as another question but

3021
02:06:55,000 --> 02:06:52,939
scientists won't even accept the reality

3022
02:06:59,379 --> 02:06:55,010
of psychic abilities and human beings

3023
02:07:03,339 --> 02:06:59,389
and to me so obvious when you rinse them

3024
02:07:05,469 --> 02:07:03,349
yourself as I have it's just absurd well

3025
02:07:09,219 --> 02:07:05,479
I think too you know you have to ask you

3026
02:07:10,779 --> 02:07:09,229
look at a really truly gifted doctor you

3027
02:07:13,089 --> 02:07:10,789
know in the emergency room I mean a lot

3028
02:07:14,949 --> 02:07:13,099
of times yes he has his training but

3029
02:07:18,069 --> 02:07:14,959
what really saves his life and sometimes

3030
02:07:20,949 --> 02:07:18,079
you'll hear a patient's life is their

3031
02:07:23,529 --> 02:07:20,959
ability to react in a split-second and

3032
02:07:25,029 --> 02:07:23,539
use their intuitive abilities to do

3033
02:07:27,489 --> 02:07:25,039
what's needed and so when you really

3034
02:07:30,609 --> 02:07:27,499
press people and you ask the right

3035
02:07:32,529 --> 02:07:30,619
questions even somebody who might think

3036
02:07:35,979 --> 02:07:32,539
that this is something to kind of laugh

3037
02:07:38,799 --> 02:07:35,989
off has an experience in their lives you

3038
02:07:40,929 --> 02:07:38,809
know a lot of people that are in the

3039
02:07:42,929 --> 02:07:40,939
emergency responders I'm in there they

3040
02:07:45,729 --> 02:07:42,939
use intuition we should all use

3041
02:07:47,799 --> 02:07:45,739
intuition and so then you just have to

3042
02:07:49,479 --> 02:07:47,809
wonder how we can get get that taking a

3043
02:07:51,699 --> 02:07:49,489
little bit further and then get funding

3044
02:07:53,169 --> 02:07:51,709
to do good research and that's the

3045
02:07:56,169 --> 02:07:53,179
million dollar question how do we obtain

3046
02:07:57,819 --> 02:07:56,179
funding yeah I mean a lot of the stuff

3047
02:08:00,219 --> 02:07:57,829
can't really study in the laboratory

3048
02:08:02,139 --> 02:08:00,229
that's part of the problem too because

3049
02:08:04,569 --> 02:08:02,149
scientists like to take things into the

3050
02:08:06,279 --> 02:08:04,579
laboratory and then repeat them that's

3051
02:08:08,290 --> 02:08:06,289
the scientific method that could be

3052
02:08:10,449 --> 02:08:08,300
repeated and shown to be true and

3053
02:08:12,489 --> 02:08:10,459
Princes physical mediumship it's

3054
02:08:14,560 --> 02:08:12,499
something that you just can't take a

3055
02:08:16,959 --> 02:08:14,570
physical medium into a lab and say

3056
02:08:18,370 --> 02:08:16,969
perform you know they have to be in the

3057
02:08:22,569 --> 02:08:18,380
right kind of environment with the right

3058
02:08:24,969 --> 02:08:22,579
people and the right etc etc and so this

3059
02:08:27,429 --> 02:08:24,979
is another difficulty for people who do

3060
02:08:28,830 --> 02:08:27,439
want to study this the subject matter is

3061
02:08:33,340 --> 02:08:28,840
not something

3062
02:08:36,670 --> 02:08:33,350
cold and clinical but that being said if

3063
02:08:38,470 --> 02:08:36,680
some of these scientists just themselves

3064
02:08:41,620 --> 02:08:38,480
sat down with some of these mediums I

3065
02:08:45,010 --> 02:08:41,630
think they'd be hard-pressed to deny the

3066
02:08:47,050 --> 02:08:45,020
reality of psychic abilities I mean

3067
02:08:49,480 --> 02:08:47,060
that's such a basement the basic thing

3068
02:08:52,390 --> 02:08:49,490
it's not to say if they want to deny the

3069
02:08:53,650 --> 02:08:52,400
reality of the afterlife that's fine

3070
02:08:55,950 --> 02:08:53,660
but they still have to deal with the

3071
02:08:58,570 --> 02:08:55,960
phenomena that actually take place and

3072
02:09:01,120 --> 02:08:58,580
they these phenomena if they're

3073
02:09:03,400 --> 02:09:01,130
generated by human beings are

3074
02:09:05,860 --> 02:09:03,410
extraordinary and and so far science

3075
02:09:08,050 --> 02:09:05,870
doesn't accept them as real or do they

3076
02:09:10,030 --> 02:09:08,060
because you look at you know you look at

3077
02:09:12,460 --> 02:09:10,040
Russell Targ and some of the work that

3078
02:09:14,920 --> 02:09:12,470
has been done and commissioned by the

3079
02:09:16,900 --> 02:09:14,930
government you know and and so there are

3080
02:09:20,110 --> 02:09:16,910
people that do take it seriously and I

3081
02:09:23,620 --> 02:09:20,120
think that it has been studied in a

3082
02:09:24,820 --> 02:09:23,630
controlled setting but that's you know

3083
02:09:26,890 --> 02:09:24,830
of course that's kind of

3084
02:09:28,450 --> 02:09:26,900
compartmentalized that's cut it's you

3085
02:09:31,360 --> 02:09:28,460
know it's something that we won't

3086
02:09:35,400 --> 02:09:31,370
necessarily have a lot of information

3087
02:09:38,680 --> 02:09:35,410
about but it has been done so hopefully

3088
02:09:40,780 --> 02:09:38,690
by individuals like him and yeah they

3089
02:09:42,580 --> 02:09:40,790
did Studies on remote viewing and within

3090
02:09:44,470 --> 02:09:42,590
the government they got some interesting

3091
02:09:45,160 --> 02:09:44,480
material but it just doesn't go far

3092
02:09:48,400 --> 02:09:45,170
enough

3093
02:09:50,670 --> 02:09:48,410
no you know it just doesn't it hasn't

3094
02:09:53,590 --> 02:09:50,680
broken through the barrier of

3095
02:09:55,120 --> 02:09:53,600
contemporary thinking you know about who

3096
02:09:56,440 --> 02:09:55,130
people are and what they can do I mean

3097
02:09:59,500 --> 02:09:56,450
it's just it's something that's

3098
02:10:02,020 --> 02:09:59,510
considered sort of on the fringe or you

3099
02:10:04,510 --> 02:10:02,030
know very very considered with

3100
02:10:07,360 --> 02:10:04,520
skepticism by the scientific community

3101
02:10:09,940 --> 02:10:07,370
in general and it's not part of the

3102
02:10:12,070 --> 02:10:09,950
integrated reality that science works

3103
02:10:14,410 --> 02:10:12,080
with and if you are do our break now

3104
02:10:16,480 --> 02:10:14,420
they should tell our listeners dr.

3105
02:10:20,710 --> 02:10:16,490
Russell Targ was a guest on the podcast

3106
02:10:23,650 --> 02:10:20,720
on March 10th 2013 so you could download

3107
02:10:24,490 --> 02:10:23,660
the show and listen to it and make your

3108
02:10:27,550 --> 02:10:24,500
own conclusions

3109
02:10:37,609 --> 02:10:27,560
we have Leslie cane Erica Luke's Jean

3110
02:10:45,770 --> 02:10:40,660
thank you for listening to GCS

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this is Micah Hanks to the graylien

3206
02:14:59,080 --> 02:14:57,020
report and you're listening to the para

3207
02:15:07,370 --> 02:14:59,090
cast the gold standard of paranormal

3208
02:15:12,510 --> 02:15:09,990
well I'm not remote-viewing anything now

3209
02:15:15,330 --> 02:15:12,520
the thing Leslie came that I've wondered

3210
02:15:18,060 --> 02:15:15,340
about remote viewing is the precision is

3211
02:15:21,270 --> 02:15:18,070
lacking even when experiments are done

3212
02:15:24,000 --> 02:15:21,280
and they seem to show evidence of

3213
02:15:26,939 --> 02:15:24,010
something going on it's not consistent

3214
02:15:28,709 --> 02:15:26,949
enough for of a high level of accuracy

3215
02:15:32,430 --> 02:15:28,719
that you need especially if you want to

3216
02:15:35,070 --> 02:15:32,440
do remote spying yeah I mean I didn't I

3217
02:15:36,720 --> 02:15:35,080
have to tell you doing because it

3218
02:15:38,399 --> 02:15:36,730
doesn't have anything to do with the

3219
02:15:40,020 --> 02:15:38,409
question of whether we survive death or

3220
02:15:42,060 --> 02:15:40,030
not and I had to really restrict my

3221
02:15:44,220 --> 02:15:42,070
focus when I was researching this book

3222
02:15:46,080 --> 02:15:44,230
it does deal with the question of what

3223
02:15:47,729 --> 02:15:46,090
kind of psychic capacity do people have

3224
02:15:50,430 --> 02:15:47,739
but it doesn't deal with the question of

3225
02:15:52,010 --> 02:15:50,440
survival past death so I have isn't

3226
02:15:54,330 --> 02:15:52,020
something I've really studied

3227
02:15:57,419 --> 02:15:54,340
unfortunately so I can't comment on it

3228
02:15:59,760 --> 02:15:57,429
what about near-death experiences it's

3229
02:16:01,740 --> 02:15:59,770
like we're almost getting there but we

3230
02:16:04,350 --> 02:16:01,750
don't then we come back or we'll pull

3231
02:16:06,030 --> 02:16:04,360
back or whatever but do we see any

3232
02:16:09,839 --> 02:16:06,040
resemblance as to what they go through

3233
02:16:11,399 --> 02:16:09,849
and what mediums produce well I think

3234
02:16:13,740 --> 02:16:11,409
it's interesting I think we do see

3235
02:16:16,350 --> 02:16:13,750
resemblance between what near-death

3236
02:16:18,750 --> 02:16:16,360
experiencers encounter what people at

3237
02:16:20,850 --> 02:16:18,760
end-of-life encounter what we call

3238
02:16:23,010 --> 02:16:20,860
intermission memories which are memories

3239
02:16:25,939 --> 02:16:23,020
that young children have of their time

3240
02:16:28,800 --> 02:16:25,949
before they were born so we do see

3241
02:16:30,810 --> 02:16:28,810
similarities in terms of people's

3242
02:16:33,690 --> 02:16:30,820
journeys what they interpret to be

3243
02:16:36,089 --> 02:16:33,700
journeys into this other realm and I

3244
02:16:37,379 --> 02:16:36,099
think that's a really important point to

3245
02:16:38,820 --> 02:16:37,389
show those similarities and I've done

3246
02:16:40,169 --> 02:16:38,830
that in the book and I think the other

3247
02:16:44,129 --> 02:16:40,179
thing that's really interesting to me

3248
02:16:45,810 --> 02:16:44,139
about the near-death experience studies

3249
02:16:48,120 --> 02:16:45,820
which I know a lot of people know a lot

3250
02:16:50,009 --> 02:16:48,130
about near-death experiences but I was

3251
02:16:52,259 --> 02:16:50,019
interested just discover the work of

3252
02:16:53,459 --> 02:16:52,269
sampar nia who is also somebody you

3253
02:16:55,500 --> 02:16:53,469
might have had on the show or would like

3254
02:16:57,990 --> 02:16:55,510
to have on the show he actually has

3255
02:17:01,379 --> 02:16:58,000
renamed it the actual death experience

3256
02:17:03,179 --> 02:17:01,389
he's an expert in resuscitation science

3257
02:17:04,709 --> 02:17:03,189
we're here in in New York at the

3258
02:17:07,770 --> 02:17:04,719
Stonybrook Institute and he has

3259
02:17:10,740 --> 02:17:07,780
discovered that people can be dead for

3260
02:17:12,810 --> 02:17:10,750
hours and still be resuscitated and as

3261
02:17:16,320 --> 02:17:12,820
far as he's concerned these people are

3262
02:17:18,450 --> 02:17:16,330
actually dead they died but then they're

3263
02:17:20,009 --> 02:17:18,460
able to come back as some of them come

3264
02:17:22,109 --> 02:17:20,019
back and talk about

3265
02:17:23,879 --> 02:17:22,119
life experiences so for him these are

3266
02:17:26,189 --> 02:17:23,889
actionable death experiences and he

3267
02:17:29,399 --> 02:17:26,199
believes that this is what all of us

3268
02:17:31,319 --> 02:17:29,409
will experience when we die it's just

3269
02:17:33,059 --> 02:17:31,329
that most of us because of what happens

3270
02:17:35,549 --> 02:17:33,069
in the brain when you're dead for two

3271
02:17:37,529 --> 02:17:35,559
hours say you don't have the capacity to

3272
02:17:40,169 --> 02:17:37,539
necessarily remember it that's why most

3273
02:17:42,239 --> 02:17:40,179
people don't remember it so I find it

3274
02:17:45,169 --> 02:17:42,249
really interesting that this in this

3275
02:17:47,699 --> 02:17:45,179
person who is so close to the science of

3276
02:17:49,739 --> 02:17:47,709
resuscitation who's an expert on it has

3277
02:17:53,309 --> 02:17:49,749
come to the conclusion that these

3278
02:17:55,199 --> 02:17:53,319
experiences are actual journeys by dead

3279
02:17:58,379 --> 02:17:55,209
people into this other realm and he's

3280
02:18:00,119 --> 02:17:58,389
completely convinced of that so he

3281
02:18:02,579 --> 02:18:00,129
doesn't think the term near-death really

3282
02:18:04,469 --> 02:18:02,589
makes any sense and I like that I like

3283
02:18:06,389 --> 02:18:04,479
calling them actual death experiences I

3284
02:18:09,119 --> 02:18:06,399
think it makes you know it gives more

3285
02:18:10,649 --> 02:18:09,129
validity to the experience of what

3286
02:18:13,499 --> 02:18:10,659
people describe so I think that's an

3287
02:18:15,299 --> 02:18:13,509
interesting perspective and I look up

3288
02:18:19,439 --> 02:18:15,309
his work it's really fascinating his

3289
02:18:20,849 --> 02:18:19,449
name Sam par Nia P AR and I a or I guess

3290
02:18:25,829 --> 02:18:20,859
you can call it a temporary death

3291
02:18:27,469 --> 02:18:25,839
experience yeah he way he looks at it is

3292
02:18:30,359 --> 02:18:27,479
they're not near-death they're dead

3293
02:18:32,309 --> 02:18:30,369
that's the way he looks at it because

3294
02:18:34,199 --> 02:18:32,319
he's seen the corpses he's he's talking

3295
02:18:37,559 --> 02:18:34,209
about help me give some cases in the

3296
02:18:39,419 --> 02:18:37,569
book of corpses you know child that was

3297
02:18:41,729 --> 02:18:39,429
dead for two hours another woman who

3298
02:18:43,709 --> 02:18:41,739
died in the forest and was dead for two

3299
02:18:45,869 --> 02:18:43,719
or three hours and they recover and

3300
02:18:48,629 --> 02:18:45,879
they're completely normal but they were

3301
02:18:51,779 --> 02:18:48,639
actually dead for that time as far as

3302
02:18:53,699 --> 02:18:51,789
he's concerned I suppose if you flatline

3303
02:18:56,849 --> 02:18:53,709
for five minutes you were dead for five

3304
02:18:59,099 --> 02:18:56,859
minutes yeah but I think the longer it

3305
02:19:00,749 --> 02:18:59,109
is the more difficult this for people to

3306
02:19:03,299 --> 02:19:00,759
accept that somebody can actually come

3307
02:19:05,749 --> 02:19:03,309
back but yeah I mean you have to ask

3308
02:19:08,219 --> 02:19:05,759
when do you draw that line of between

3309
02:19:10,349 --> 02:19:08,229
being actually dead and being just

3310
02:19:12,839 --> 02:19:10,359
unconscious I mean the science of that

3311
02:19:14,369 --> 02:19:12,849
is I'm sure complicated okay so if

3312
02:19:17,279 --> 02:19:14,379
near-death experiences are really

3313
02:19:19,199 --> 02:19:17,289
temporary death experiences we go back

3314
02:19:23,539 --> 02:19:19,209
to when I was talking about earlier the

3315
02:19:27,569 --> 02:19:23,549
concept that UFO abductions might have

3316
02:19:29,849 --> 02:19:27,579
parallels with near-death experiences so

3317
02:19:31,949 --> 02:19:29,859
what does that make the UFO abduction

3318
02:19:34,230 --> 02:19:31,959
experience I bet you can answer that

3319
02:19:37,320 --> 02:19:34,240
better than I can Jean I

3320
02:19:39,330 --> 02:19:37,330
but that's the point if it's similar it

3321
02:19:41,190 --> 02:19:39,340
means the same mechanism is affecting

3322
02:19:44,580 --> 02:19:41,200
both that the person who had the

3323
02:19:45,870 --> 02:19:44,590
abduction temporarily died i mean who

3324
02:19:48,660 --> 02:19:45,880
says that the people who has the

3325
02:19:50,220 --> 02:19:48,670
abduction are dead I don't know so I

3326
02:19:52,921 --> 02:19:50,230
thought they were fully conscious and

3327
02:19:54,541 --> 02:19:52,931
were physically removed from their beds

3328
02:19:58,200 --> 02:19:54,551
and taken onto a ship and then brought

3329
02:19:59,730 --> 02:19:58,210
back of course I just wonder though and

3330
02:20:01,341 --> 02:19:59,740
this is something I guess that has

3331
02:20:04,950 --> 02:20:01,351
always been difficult to investigate

3332
02:20:08,430 --> 02:20:04,960
what we'd see during this period in

3333
02:20:10,980 --> 02:20:08,440
under which there somewhere else so

3334
02:20:12,421 --> 02:20:10,990
someone is telling us they were aboard a

3335
02:20:15,030 --> 02:20:12,431
spaceship they were taken out of their

3336
02:20:16,740 --> 02:20:15,040
bedrooms if we actually had a camera

3337
02:20:18,600 --> 02:20:16,750
running and that's always been the

3338
02:20:20,970 --> 02:20:18,610
problem with UFO abductions because

3339
02:20:23,850 --> 02:20:20,980
sometimes the cameras mysteriously

3340
02:20:27,450 --> 02:20:23,860
turned off something always happens but

3341
02:20:29,400 --> 02:20:27,460
we never see the correlation while they

3342
02:20:32,490 --> 02:20:29,410
are being abducted are they actually

3343
02:20:34,230 --> 02:20:32,500
still here at the same time right so

3344
02:20:36,240 --> 02:20:34,240
you're suggesting maybe they leave their

3345
02:20:37,980 --> 02:20:36,250
bodies and they when there have done but

3346
02:20:39,480 --> 02:20:37,990
therefore all these physical things are

3347
02:20:41,700 --> 02:20:39,490
done to their bodies while they're in

3348
02:20:44,341 --> 02:20:41,710
the spaceship as they report it seems

3349
02:20:46,140 --> 02:20:44,351
like their bodies are involved they must

3350
02:20:47,881 --> 02:20:46,150
be physically missing I think there are

3351
02:20:49,791 --> 02:20:47,891
cases where the person is physically

3352
02:20:51,841 --> 02:20:49,801
missing while they're being abducted

3353
02:20:53,131 --> 02:20:51,851
right and I think many researchers

3354
02:20:54,780 --> 02:20:53,141
though have brought up the fact that

3355
02:20:57,860 --> 02:20:54,790
there could be two things at play the

3356
02:21:01,740 --> 02:20:57,870
physical abduction and then more of a

3357
02:21:03,360 --> 02:21:01,750
mental abduction so I think it's curious

3358
02:21:06,600 --> 02:21:03,370
but I think also to Jean with the

3359
02:21:09,301 --> 02:21:06,610
parallels between UFOs and and E's I

3360
02:21:12,060 --> 02:21:09,311
mean it seems like once you have a

3361
02:21:15,541 --> 02:21:12,070
near-death experience that your life

3362
02:21:18,720 --> 02:21:15,551
changes you become more intuitive you

3363
02:21:22,381 --> 02:21:18,730
become more concerned about about nature

3364
02:21:25,950 --> 02:21:22,391
about the planet you also perhaps might

3365
02:21:29,400 --> 02:21:25,960
have more paranormal or UFO experiences

3366
02:21:31,501 --> 02:21:29,410
and so there is kind of a common thread

3367
02:21:34,140 --> 02:21:31,511
it opens you up to something and that

3368
02:21:36,120 --> 02:21:34,150
that is definitely something an area to

3369
02:21:39,930 --> 02:21:36,130
study and I know that people are looking

3370
02:21:42,780 --> 02:21:39,940
into the correlations the thing I always

3371
02:21:45,541 --> 02:21:42,790
wondered also when we look at this when

3372
02:21:46,740 --> 02:21:45,551
you talk to people who see UFOs this has

3373
02:21:49,110 --> 02:21:46,750
been one of the Bugaboos

3374
02:21:53,730 --> 02:21:49,120
certain organizations that shall go

3375
02:21:56,160 --> 02:21:53,740
unnamed are very busy writing down the

3376
02:21:59,310 --> 02:21:56,170
UFO experience but they don't look into

3377
02:22:01,410 --> 02:21:59,320
the background of the witness that

3378
02:22:04,140 --> 02:22:01,420
anything happened before or after that

3379
02:22:07,140 --> 02:22:04,150
UFO was seen what about their background

3380
02:22:08,730 --> 02:22:07,150
it never gets investigated so there

3381
02:22:12,390 --> 02:22:08,740
might be a lot of data out there we

3382
02:22:14,130 --> 02:22:12,400
never receive exactly and that's

3383
02:22:15,270 --> 02:22:14,140
important I mean I think your emotional

3384
02:22:17,880 --> 02:22:15,280
state

3385
02:22:19,100 --> 02:22:17,890
what childhood traumas I mean there are

3386
02:22:21,720 --> 02:22:19,110
many different things that you need to

3387
02:22:24,630 --> 02:22:21,730
to research it's not just it and

3388
02:22:25,950 --> 02:22:24,640
isolated incidents you know a ten minute

3389
02:22:31,170 --> 02:22:25,960
sighting and that's all you're looking

3390
02:22:33,050 --> 02:22:31,180
at it's a complex complex puzzle sounds

3391
02:22:35,760 --> 02:22:33,060
like one of the arguments I've had with

3392
02:22:37,740 --> 02:22:35,770
people who are involved in certain

3393
02:22:41,640 --> 02:22:37,750
organizations why don't you ask that

3394
02:22:44,880 --> 02:22:41,650
question and the international director

3395
02:22:47,550 --> 02:22:44,890
of that certain organization and listen

3396
02:22:49,340 --> 02:22:47,560
but said they don't do it now I wonder

3397
02:22:52,170 --> 02:22:49,350
if he even understood the need for it

3398
02:22:54,920 --> 02:22:52,180
that's an interesting thing to Leslie

3399
02:22:58,680 --> 02:22:54,930
when you were doing your UFO research

3400
02:23:00,270 --> 02:22:58,690
did you make an effort then to look into

3401
02:23:03,270 --> 02:23:00,280
the backgrounds of the people who saw

3402
02:23:06,080 --> 02:23:03,280
these things to some extent I mean so

3403
02:23:08,610 --> 02:23:06,090
many people that I was dealing with were

3404
02:23:10,770 --> 02:23:08,620
established military people people that

3405
02:23:12,900 --> 02:23:10,780
were not new to the field such as

3406
02:23:14,670 --> 02:23:12,910
someone like Colonel Charles halt I

3407
02:23:16,830 --> 02:23:14,680
certainly knew a lot about his

3408
02:23:19,710 --> 02:23:16,840
background when I before I even talked

3409
02:23:21,180 --> 02:23:19,720
to him but obviously it's very important

3410
02:23:23,520 --> 02:23:21,190
and it is important to know whether

3411
02:23:25,140 --> 02:23:23,530
they've had other experiences as well as

3412
02:23:26,550 --> 02:23:25,150
the one you happen to be dealing with in

3413
02:23:29,040 --> 02:23:26,560
the moment I mean to me that seems like

3414
02:23:34,680 --> 02:23:29,050
a critical question to be asked of any

3415
02:23:36,570 --> 02:23:34,690
witness so I would think that would be

3416
02:23:38,840 --> 02:23:36,580
important and maybe the investigators

3417
02:23:42,150 --> 02:23:38,850
you're talking about are afraid of

3418
02:23:44,540 --> 02:23:42,160
somehow alienating - for lack of a

3419
02:23:47,550 --> 02:23:44,550
better word or distancing the witness or

3420
02:23:49,170 --> 02:23:47,560
frightening the witness away by asking

3421
02:23:50,610 --> 02:23:49,180
them a lot of questions that the witness

3422
02:23:52,710 --> 02:23:50,620
may feel oh my god they're gonna think

3423
02:23:55,890 --> 02:23:52,720
I'm crazy or something maybe it's got to

3424
02:23:58,170 --> 02:23:55,900
do with that I don't know I think that

3425
02:24:00,331 --> 02:23:58,180
there are some that's some great issues

3426
02:24:02,070 --> 02:24:00,341
with that I also think too

3427
02:24:04,201 --> 02:24:02,080
you're coming from a place of looking

3428
02:24:07,680 --> 02:24:04,211
for data and trying to convince the

3429
02:24:10,621 --> 02:24:07,690
mainstream you also have to just give

3430
02:24:13,591 --> 02:24:10,631
them what they can what is palatable for

3431
02:24:16,381 --> 02:24:13,601
them so perhaps that's another reason

3432
02:24:19,440 --> 02:24:16,391
why we don't go much beyond the initial

3433
02:24:22,261 --> 02:24:19,450
sighting we got more to come final

3434
02:24:25,350 --> 02:24:22,271
segment with Leslie Cain our guest

3435
02:24:37,139 --> 02:24:25,360
co-host is Erica Luke's you're in the

3436
02:24:47,099 --> 02:24:41,070
you are listening to GPS

3437
02:24:48,929 --> 02:24:47,109
visit GCN live.com today we also have

3438
02:24:52,500 --> 02:24:48,939
swag you know we have all these

3439
02:24:53,040 --> 02:24:52,510
exclusive para cast things that you can

3440
02:24:54,990 --> 02:24:53,050
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3441
02:24:57,809 --> 02:24:55,000
we've got like I guess 60 or so

3442
02:25:01,380 --> 02:24:57,819
different items and entails t-shirts

3443
02:25:04,710 --> 02:25:01,390
sleeves for notebook computers iPad

3444
02:25:07,050 --> 02:25:04,720
cases mouse pads the para cast jumbo

3445
02:25:08,849 --> 02:25:07,060
tote bag all sorts of t-shirts and

3446
02:25:09,150 --> 02:25:08,859
jackets and stuff like that for men and

3447
02:25:12,090 --> 02:25:09,160
women

3448
02:25:14,910 --> 02:25:12,100
we have a para cast aluminum water

3449
02:25:19,080 --> 02:25:14,920
bottle all the stuff you go to store . ^

3450
02:25:21,690 --> 02:25:19,090
cast calm stored dr parra cast calm what

3451
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makes special is that the items are the

3452
02:25:26,639 --> 02:25:24,399
best quality of great t-shirts fabrics

3453
02:25:27,870 --> 02:25:26,649
and they have our official logo on them

3454
02:25:29,760 --> 02:25:27,880
that's what makes them special in

3455
02:25:32,580 --> 02:25:29,770
multiple sizes and colors

3456
02:25:34,920 --> 02:25:32,590
we even have stuff for children stuff

3457
02:25:37,860 --> 02:25:34,930
for women's stuff for men we have all

3458
02:25:39,960 --> 02:25:37,870
sorts of sizes like small up 2x large a

3459
02:25:43,380 --> 02:25:39,970
lot good stuff that's the swag from the

3460
02:25:46,650 --> 02:25:43,390
para cast to go to store . ^ cast calm

3461
02:25:48,030 --> 02:25:46,660
stop by and take a shopping tour did you

3462
02:25:50,040 --> 02:25:48,040
know there's a new group of water

3463
02:25:52,260 --> 02:25:50,050
contaminants with unknown health effects

3464
02:25:53,610 --> 02:25:52,270
these emerging contaminants lurking in

3465
02:25:55,860 --> 02:25:53,620
your water may include prescription

3466
02:25:58,440 --> 02:25:55,870
over-the-counter drugs in new types of

3467
02:26:02,429 --> 02:25:58,450
herbicides and pesticides procures

3468
02:26:04,620 --> 02:26:02,439
improve pro 1g 2.0 filter meets NSF 401

3469
02:26:06,990 --> 02:26:04,630
standards to help produce these emerging

3470
02:26:09,450 --> 02:26:07,000
contaminants to find out more visit your

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authorized propio dealer or procure

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usa.com that's PR o bu r us a.com

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looking for that edge during those

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intimate moments we see many ads for

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enhancement but the side effects include

3476
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death at GCN team we should change the

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healthy body brain and heart pack to the

3478
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healthy libido pack the brain and heart

3479
02:26:32,849 --> 02:26:30,310
are not the only organs that require a

3480
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healthy vascular system for proper blood

3481
02:26:35,940 --> 02:26:35,140
flow at the right moment go to GCN

3482
02:26:37,800 --> 02:26:35,950
team.com

3483
02:26:40,590 --> 02:26:37,810
or call eight seven seven eight seven

3484
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eight 4203 that's eight seven seven

3485
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eight seven eight 4203 that's eight

3486
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can happen in six seconds a rodeo ride a

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dramatic basketball win and the world

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record holder can solve a Rubik's Cube

3489
02:27:00,650 --> 02:26:58,440
six seconds is how long it takes for an

3490
02:27:03,260 --> 02:27:00,660
18-wheeler traveling at a safe speed to

3491
02:27:04,970 --> 02:27:03,270
come to a complete stop and in those six

3492
02:27:07,160 --> 02:27:04,980
seconds that truck will travel the

3493
02:27:09,770 --> 02:27:07,170
length of two football fields so please

3494
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give them room never cut in front of a

3495
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large truck for any reason bar roads are

3496
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responsibilities learn more and share

3497
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the road safely guv if you're 85 or

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02:27:22,100 --> 02:27:19,890
younger

3499
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would you like peace of mind and comfort

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3501
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the average funeral today costs over

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will your family pay the difference we

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3510
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President Trump is really shaking up

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Washington and the media David Horowitz

3526
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his new book big agenda reveals Trump's

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secret plans now big agenda is a New

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news max 800 news max or big agenda for

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02:28:54,080 --> 02:28:45,840
one one.com that's big agenda for one

3534
02:28:58,679 --> 02:28:56,700
hi this is Bryce Abel I'm the producer

3535
02:29:00,599 --> 02:28:58,689
of dark skies the co-author of AD after

3536
02:29:02,780 --> 02:29:00,609
disclosure and you are listening to the

3537
02:29:11,361 --> 02:29:02,790
para cast the gold standard of

3538
02:29:16,921 --> 02:29:14,581
so of course I would think Leslie Kane

3539
02:29:20,131 --> 02:29:16,931
that if that kind of question was on the

3540
02:29:23,011 --> 02:29:20,141
table the investigator would be careful

3541
02:29:24,961 --> 02:29:23,021
it wouldn't overload the witness with

3542
02:29:27,541 --> 02:29:24,971
the questions would ask a few questions

3543
02:29:30,600 --> 02:29:27,551
to open the door and if the door wasn't

3544
02:29:32,520 --> 02:29:30,610
open just move beyond it that's true I

3545
02:29:34,470 --> 02:29:32,530
mean you have to know how to build up

3546
02:29:36,690 --> 02:29:34,480
the trust of that person you may have to

3547
02:29:39,211 --> 02:29:36,700
go back a number of times and get to

3548
02:29:40,951 --> 02:29:39,221
know them and make them feel safe and

3549
02:29:43,230 --> 02:29:40,961
talking about these things I mean every

3550
02:29:46,440 --> 02:29:43,240
witness is so different and even seeing

3551
02:29:49,081 --> 02:29:46,450
a UFO is not always something wonderful

3552
02:29:50,281 --> 02:29:49,091
for a person and so I think you just

3553
02:29:52,980 --> 02:29:50,291
have to be very sensitive any

3554
02:29:54,241 --> 02:29:52,990
investigator does to the state of mind

3555
02:29:56,551 --> 02:29:54,251
of the of the person they're

3556
02:29:58,741 --> 02:29:56,561
interviewing and at the same time you've

3557
02:30:01,680 --> 02:29:58,751
got to do your job you just have to find

3558
02:30:03,930 --> 02:30:01,690
a way to do it that makes the witness

3559
02:30:05,430 --> 02:30:03,940
come feel comfortable anyway it's it's

3560
02:30:07,650 --> 02:30:05,440
it's difficult when you're dealing with

3561
02:30:11,100 --> 02:30:07,660
people who have had unusual experiences

3562
02:30:12,631 --> 02:30:11,110
it can be a complicated process and they

3563
02:30:14,761 --> 02:30:12,641
can feel very vulnerable and talking

3564
02:30:17,071 --> 02:30:14,771
about it with your book you've opened a

3565
02:30:18,930 --> 02:30:17,081
lot of doors Leslie Cain where do you

3566
02:30:20,940 --> 02:30:18,940
plan on going to from here is there

3567
02:30:22,591 --> 02:30:20,950
going to be a sequel Jane I feel like

3568
02:30:24,390 --> 02:30:22,601
I've just gotten started with this book

3569
02:30:26,791 --> 02:30:24,400
to tell you the truth it was a journey

3570
02:30:28,741 --> 02:30:26,801
it was an exploration for me I wished

3571
02:30:31,501 --> 02:30:28,751
I'd had a couple more years before

3572
02:30:33,900 --> 02:30:31,511
concluding the book so really I just

3573
02:30:36,541 --> 02:30:33,910
want to keep studying and learning and

3574
02:30:39,751 --> 02:30:36,551
exploring the material that's in my book

3575
02:30:41,671 --> 02:30:39,761
and getting it out there to people I

3576
02:30:42,871 --> 02:30:41,681
can't even think beyond that at this

3577
02:30:44,821 --> 02:30:42,881
point sorry

3578
02:30:47,220 --> 02:30:44,831
you know I'm involved with this book

3579
02:30:50,190 --> 02:30:47,230
quite a while before I could conceive of

3580
02:30:52,831 --> 02:30:50,200
doing anything else how did your life or

3581
02:30:54,720 --> 02:30:52,841
expectations change from the point you

3582
02:30:57,091 --> 02:30:54,730
started the book to the time that you

3583
02:30:58,890 --> 02:30:57,101
submitted it to the publisher I never

3584
02:31:01,621 --> 02:30:58,900
would have expected to have been so

3585
02:31:04,411 --> 02:31:01,631
personally affected by it and to have

3586
02:31:06,690 --> 02:31:04,421
experienced what I did I knew I would

3587
02:31:08,281 --> 02:31:06,700
probably go to some mental mediums I

3588
02:31:10,890 --> 02:31:08,291
mean that was certainly was gonna happen

3589
02:31:14,071 --> 02:31:10,900
and that's something anybody can do but

3590
02:31:16,261 --> 02:31:14,081
I never expected that I would have such

3591
02:31:18,270 --> 02:31:16,271
extraordinary experiences with physical

3592
02:31:20,100 --> 02:31:18,280
mediumship or with after death

3593
02:31:21,131 --> 02:31:20,110
communications which are both components

3594
02:31:24,701 --> 02:31:21,141
of the book so

3595
02:31:26,711 --> 02:31:24,711
it turned out to be more of a personal

3596
02:31:28,270 --> 02:31:26,721
journey that I might have expected mixed

3597
02:31:30,761 --> 02:31:28,280
in with the research I mean I'd say that

3598
02:31:32,890 --> 02:31:30,771
research is certainly four-fifths of the

3599
02:31:35,680 --> 02:31:32,900
book or three-fifths of the book and

3600
02:31:36,940 --> 02:31:35,690
it's very engaging it's not dry or any

3601
02:31:39,491 --> 02:31:36,950
kind anything like that so I'm very

3602
02:31:41,291 --> 02:31:39,501
engaged with the whole thing but I was

3603
02:31:43,331 --> 02:31:41,301
the main thing that I didn't expect I

3604
02:31:45,581 --> 02:31:43,341
think was how personal the whole thing

3605
02:31:47,261 --> 02:31:45,591
would become and how personally involved

3606
02:31:49,060 --> 02:31:47,271
I would become with these direct

3607
02:31:52,241 --> 02:31:49,070
experiences that I never expected to

3608
02:31:54,220 --> 02:31:52,251
have it was like a gift was handed to me

3609
02:31:56,261 --> 02:31:54,230
at the right time for the timing was

3610
02:31:58,541 --> 02:31:56,271
perfect not that I was very unhappy to

3611
02:32:00,970 --> 02:31:58,551
lose my brother of course but the fact

3612
02:32:03,310 --> 02:32:00,980
that he died when I began researching

3613
02:32:05,680 --> 02:32:03,320
this book and then I had these

3614
02:32:07,301 --> 02:32:05,690
experiences of connection with him the

3615
02:32:10,150 --> 02:32:07,311
timing of everything kind of worked out

3616
02:32:12,220 --> 02:32:10,160
beautifully I was just all very

3617
02:32:13,810 --> 02:32:12,230
unexpected it is wonderful that you

3618
02:32:16,511 --> 02:32:13,820
could have these profound personal

3619
02:32:19,451 --> 02:32:16,521
experiences I think sometimes you know

3620
02:32:21,881 --> 02:32:19,461
we try to get taken so seriously with

3621
02:32:24,161 --> 02:32:21,891
science and and there's certain things

3622
02:32:27,251 --> 02:32:24,171
that we just I guess have to understand

3623
02:32:29,861 --> 02:32:27,261
or like you say personal experiences

3624
02:32:31,690 --> 02:32:29,871
that can never be proven beyond a

3625
02:32:34,350 --> 02:32:31,700
reasonable doubt but you just cherish

3626
02:32:36,581 --> 02:32:34,360
them as a beautiful experience for you

3627
02:32:37,991 --> 02:32:36,591
exactly and you have to interpret them

3628
02:32:40,301 --> 02:32:38,001
in your own way as well

3629
02:32:42,491 --> 02:32:40,311
and find your own meaning in them which

3630
02:32:44,980 --> 02:32:42,501
I did but I've also been very analytical

3631
02:32:46,301 --> 02:32:44,990
of them in the book and you know looked

3632
02:32:48,761 --> 02:32:46,311
at the different thing the different

3633
02:32:51,461 --> 02:32:48,771
ways that can be explained that to me

3634
02:32:53,741 --> 02:32:51,471
was also an interesting process I feel

3635
02:32:56,350 --> 02:32:53,751
kind of vulnerable to tell you the truth

3636
02:32:58,180 --> 02:32:56,360
because I'm a journalist and journalists

3637
02:33:00,041 --> 02:32:58,190
don't usually talk about the kinds of

3638
02:33:02,501 --> 02:33:00,051
things that happen to me in this book I

3639
02:33:05,650 --> 02:33:02,511
mean they don't usually mix that in with

3640
02:33:07,991 --> 02:33:05,660
research and I feel like I sort of taken

3641
02:33:09,701 --> 02:33:08,001
a risk by doing that but I also feel it

3642
02:33:11,951 --> 02:33:09,711
makes for more a more interesting book

3643
02:33:13,331 --> 02:33:11,961
for people to read and I hope that

3644
02:33:15,701 --> 02:33:13,341
people understand

3645
02:33:17,381 --> 02:33:15,711
I really am objective they really can

3646
02:33:19,661 --> 02:33:17,391
trust me you know when I report on

3647
02:33:23,190 --> 02:33:19,671
something that happened to me I use the

3648
02:33:25,631 --> 02:33:23,200
same standards of rigor and factual

3649
02:33:28,480 --> 02:33:25,641
analysis and factual reporting that I

3650
02:33:31,270 --> 02:33:28,490
use for everything else that I do and I

3651
02:33:33,701 --> 02:33:31,280
hope that people realize that they can

3652
02:33:34,930 --> 02:33:33,711
trust me I'm not making things up that

3653
02:33:37,030 --> 02:33:34,940
might allow them to be

3654
02:33:39,820 --> 02:33:37,040
to more easily accept these experiences

3655
02:33:41,680 --> 02:33:39,830
as being real just because of the nature

3656
02:33:43,301 --> 02:33:41,690
of the way I approach things so I'm

3657
02:33:46,180 --> 02:33:43,311
hoping that might be a gift that I can

3658
02:33:48,070 --> 02:33:46,190
give to people also Erica we have any

3659
02:33:50,230 --> 02:33:48,080
unanswered questions in our question

3660
02:33:53,831 --> 02:33:50,240
Bank that we could look into before we

3661
02:33:55,450 --> 02:33:53,841
let Leslie leave the building yeah we

3662
02:33:58,631 --> 02:33:55,460
have this seatbelt that would kind of

3663
02:34:01,301 --> 02:33:58,641
hold her in place do this we try to make

3664
02:34:07,570 --> 02:34:01,311
it comfortable and we don't use Takata

3665
02:34:10,240 --> 02:34:07,580
airbags Takata airbags by the way folks

3666
02:34:13,720 --> 02:34:10,250
is that Bram that has made defective

3667
02:34:15,100 --> 02:34:13,730
airbags and millions of cars right of

3668
02:34:17,350 --> 02:34:15,110
course you never know because there's no

3669
02:34:20,560 --> 02:34:17,360
big sign saying your airbag is made by

3670
02:34:26,381 --> 02:34:20,570
Takata change it or it may not go off

3671
02:34:27,911 --> 02:34:26,391
when you have that accident well they

3672
02:34:29,140 --> 02:34:27,921
know by serial number you know if they

3673
02:34:31,990 --> 02:34:29,150
look up the serial number they'll figure

3674
02:34:37,180 --> 02:34:32,000
it out Erica any more questions Oh her

3675
02:34:39,190 --> 02:34:37,190
internet is down alright so so she sent

3676
02:34:40,900 --> 02:34:39,200
me that her smartphone all right let's

3677
02:34:44,470 --> 02:34:40,910
just continue like she's still there

3678
02:34:47,140 --> 02:34:44,480
and we pretend that she's still there in

3679
02:34:49,140 --> 02:34:47,150
a way to continue what we're talking

3680
02:34:52,961 --> 02:34:49,150
about here and this is the kind of

3681
02:34:55,211 --> 02:34:52,971
change your life do you think you know

3682
02:34:57,551 --> 02:34:55,221
it's a common image here we don't want

3683
02:35:00,820 --> 02:34:57,561
to be the negative person here it's a

3684
02:35:03,940 --> 02:35:00,830
common image here that the possibility

3685
02:35:08,011 --> 02:35:03,950
of an afterlife is less credible and the

3686
02:35:11,621 --> 02:35:08,021
possibility of UFOs has that in any way

3687
02:35:14,680 --> 02:35:11,631
impacted you at all yeah I mean I would

3688
02:35:16,631 --> 02:35:14,690
think that the I would I would say it

3689
02:35:19,091 --> 02:35:16,641
this way I think the possibility of an

3690
02:35:22,121 --> 02:35:19,101
afterlife is less credible than the

3691
02:35:25,450 --> 02:35:22,131
physical phenomenon of UFOs than the

3692
02:35:27,310 --> 02:35:25,460
data which is radar witness you know

3693
02:35:30,251 --> 02:35:27,320
official documentation the kind of data

3694
02:35:35,230 --> 02:35:30,261
that I present in my book but I think

3695
02:35:38,381 --> 02:35:35,240
that the the phenomena of the survival

3696
02:35:41,230 --> 02:35:38,391
question are just as real as the UFOs

3697
02:35:43,121 --> 02:35:41,240
are real so the phenomena that occur in

3698
02:35:45,640 --> 02:35:43,131
the seance room the memories that

3699
02:35:47,700 --> 02:35:45,650
children have the near-death experiences

3700
02:35:48,760 --> 02:35:47,710
the actual things that happen are

3701
02:35:52,569 --> 02:35:48,770
absolute

3702
02:35:54,399 --> 02:35:52,579
real butt like UFOs it's the question of

3703
02:35:56,769 --> 02:35:54,409
what they are and how you interpret them

3704
02:35:59,859 --> 02:35:56,779
that is still open for debate and that's

3705
02:36:02,439 --> 02:35:59,869
true with the survival question I do

3706
02:36:05,559 --> 02:36:02,449
these things show that we survive death

3707
02:36:07,330 --> 02:36:05,569
or are they products of some kind of

3708
02:36:10,120 --> 02:36:07,340
psychic abilities that is so

3709
02:36:13,059 --> 02:36:10,130
sophisticated that we have no idea what

3710
02:36:14,319 --> 02:36:13,069
it's about it's limitless all the

3711
02:36:17,170 --> 02:36:14,329
theories that have been proposed to

3712
02:36:20,170 --> 02:36:17,180
explain it so I think in both cases we

3713
02:36:22,179 --> 02:36:20,180
have phenomena that we know are real but

3714
02:36:24,099 --> 02:36:22,189
it's the interpretation of them that is

3715
02:36:25,540 --> 02:36:24,109
still the question that's hard to

3716
02:36:28,630 --> 02:36:25,550
resolve and that applies to the question

3717
02:36:30,760 --> 02:36:28,640
of survival as well but I also feel that

3718
02:36:32,620 --> 02:36:30,770
the data that the stories and the

3719
02:36:35,800 --> 02:36:32,630
information I presented my book is

3720
02:36:36,910 --> 02:36:35,810
highly suggestive of the reality of

3721
02:36:38,649 --> 02:36:36,920
survival after death

3722
02:36:40,750 --> 02:36:38,659
highly suggested that this could be real

3723
02:36:43,059 --> 02:36:40,760
and people can make up their own minds

3724
02:36:46,569 --> 02:36:43,069
just like the UFO phenomenon certainly

3725
02:36:48,099 --> 02:36:46,579
suggests an extraterrestrial visitor so

3726
02:36:50,019 --> 02:36:48,109
to me they're sort of comparable in that

3727
02:36:52,389 --> 02:36:50,029
way I hope that I hope that makes sense

3728
02:36:54,250 --> 02:36:52,399
Leslie Cain please tell our listeners if

3729
02:36:57,279 --> 02:36:54,260
they have more questions and want to

3730
02:36:59,519 --> 02:36:57,289
know more about your research into the

3731
02:37:02,170 --> 02:36:59,529
afterlife where do they check you out

3732
02:37:05,229 --> 02:37:02,180
thanks gene I would love for people to

3733
02:37:08,500 --> 02:37:05,239
come to my website which is surviving

3734
02:37:11,559 --> 02:37:08,510
death cane dot-com it's my last name ke

3735
02:37:14,529 --> 02:37:11,569
a n and from there you can link to my

3736
02:37:17,170 --> 02:37:14,539
facebook page or just go directly to my

3737
02:37:19,120 --> 02:37:17,180
Facebook page I have very lively

3738
02:37:21,519 --> 02:37:19,130
discussions on that page with people I'm

3739
02:37:23,500 --> 02:37:21,529
very involved with it and active and we

3740
02:37:24,969 --> 02:37:23,510
can have conversations and ask questions

3741
02:37:26,979 --> 02:37:24,979
and discussions and all kinds of things

3742
02:37:28,450 --> 02:37:26,989
like I post all my media appearances

3743
02:37:30,760 --> 02:37:28,460
there I'll be posting this interview

3744
02:37:32,500 --> 02:37:30,770
there I really love interaction with

3745
02:37:35,349 --> 02:37:32,510
people who are interested in this topic

3746
02:37:38,380 --> 02:37:35,359
again and my website is surviving deaf

3747
02:37:39,939 --> 02:37:38,390
can calm it also makes it very easy for

3748
02:37:42,729 --> 02:37:39,949
you to buy the book if you want to buy

3749
02:37:44,740 --> 02:37:42,739
it and it's available in audiobook which

3750
02:37:47,410 --> 02:37:44,750
is read by me by the way it's also

3751
02:37:49,599 --> 02:37:47,420
available in Kindle and in hardcopy so I

3752
02:37:51,729 --> 02:37:49,609
really hope to hear from from people who

3753
02:37:53,740 --> 02:37:51,739
have been listening today you can find

3754
02:37:56,170 --> 02:37:53,750
us on Twitter if you look for the power

3755
02:37:59,889 --> 02:37:56,180
cast look forward to official podcast

3756
02:38:01,929 --> 02:37:59,899
fan clubs on Facebook look for after the

3757
02:38:02,291 --> 02:38:01,939
power cast it's the second radio show we

3758
02:38:04,961 --> 02:38:02,301
do

3759
02:38:07,661 --> 02:38:04,971
and it's available only if you subscribe

3760
02:38:10,621 --> 02:38:07,671
to the podcast plus to learn more get

3761
02:38:15,310 --> 02:38:10,631
all the simple side directions go to

3762
02:38:17,771 --> 02:38:15,320
plus PL us dot the para cast com+ dot

3763
02:38:19,211 --> 02:38:17,781
the power cast comm you also get a

3764
02:38:22,390 --> 02:38:19,221
commercial free version of this show

3765
02:38:25,060 --> 02:38:22,400
where we remove 41 minutes of the

3766
02:38:27,970 --> 02:38:25,070
network gets better quality audio and

3767
02:38:29,951 --> 02:38:27,980
the after the power cast podcast special

3768
02:38:33,011 --> 02:38:29,961
selected items from Paul Kimball's other

3769
02:38:35,831 --> 02:38:33,021
side of truth and more plus thought the

3770
02:38:37,481 --> 02:38:35,841
para cast comedy also on of an Erica

3771
02:38:40,691 --> 02:38:37,491
Luke's through dropping in as the guest

3772
02:38:43,301 --> 02:38:40,701
co-host when Chris was on special

3773
02:38:45,430 --> 02:38:43,311
assignment Leslie is so happy to have

3774
02:38:48,131 --> 02:38:45,440
you back on the show thanks for joining

3775
02:39:02,761 --> 02:38:48,141
us on the para cast thanks jeans and

3776
02:39:09,191 --> 02:39:06,281
the para cast featuring gene Steinberg

3777
02:39:12,180 --> 02:39:09,201
and Christopher O'Brien is a copyrighted

3778
02:39:15,911 --> 02:39:12,190
presentation of making the impossible